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Old 07-14-2015, 08:29 PM
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TJ to JK

Would you trade in an 04 stock TJ Sahara with 49000 miles for an 09 stock JK Sahara with 49400 miles?

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Old 07-14-2015, 08:39 PM   #2
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I would take my TJ Sahara with 190,000 miles over my jku Sahara with 60,000 miles any day. The TJ is just such a simpler and more fun jeep in my opinion.

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Old 07-14-2015, 08:41 PM   #3
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Would you trade in an 04 stock TJ Sahara with 49000 miles for an 09 stock JK Sahara with 49400 miles?
no
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Old 07-14-2015, 08:41 PM   #4
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Your 4.0l engine will last longer than the 3.8l. I have read this in JP magazine, talked with my Smog guy, Petersen's magazine, etc.
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Old 07-14-2015, 08:52 PM   #5
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Hell 2 the no
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Old 07-14-2015, 08:54 PM   #6
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Yes in a heartbeat if the 09 is mechanically sound. Some 3.8's do burn oil so that is something to be aware of, but gaining 5 years and a newer model of vehicle for no cost while keeping the mileage the same should be a no brainer.
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Old 07-14-2015, 09:02 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Espo78 View Post
Yes in a heartbeat if the 09 is mechanically sound. Some 3.8's do burn oil so that is something to be aware of, but gaining 5 years and a newer model of vehicle for no cost while keeping the mileage the same should be a no brainer.
Agreed, I would do it
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Old 07-14-2015, 09:35 PM   #8
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Did he say even trade? I read trade in
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Old 07-14-2015, 10:33 PM   #9
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I wouldn't hesitate on a 2012+. An 09? Meh! Even then I'd only do it if the Jeep was supposed to be a DD. If it was dedicated trail/fun rig, I'd keep the TJ. For a DD, JK's are far superior...the 2012 and on anyway. Besides, at that rate, the 4.0 in the TJ will probably outlast you. I thought my 98 with 113000 when I sold it last year was low miles.
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Old 07-14-2015, 10:45 PM   #10
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I traded my TJ with 42k Miles's to a 15 rubicon. The JK is nice but I really do miss the TJ. Less fear of something going bad on me. I understood what noises would pop up and their meanings. I miss not having stability control. The system is intrusive to say the lease. Mpgs are a wash.
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Old 07-14-2015, 10:59 PM   #11
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If you are talking a TJ for a JK (not a JKU) I am not sure what you would gain. The mileage is the same, but as listed, there are questions about the the longevity of the 3.8.

As the driver of a 2003 with 117,000 miles, an 04 with only 49,000 miles on it is considered low mileage, an '09 with 49,000 not so much. If the 2009 has manual windows, consider this, you can lean over and roll the TJ passenger window up and down. In the 2009 Sahara, you would have power windows.

I have a friend who has a 1998 Sahara that is in very good condition. If he offered to trade it to my for my '03 Rubicon, I would have to seriously consider it. There is just something that is so balanced about the TJ Sahara.
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Old 07-14-2015, 11:51 PM   #12
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I've had a YJ,TJ and now a JK. Never cared for JK's much until I actually started looking at them to buy one. Traded in my 02 4.0 5 speed on an 11 3.8 auto 2 door and have been more than happy with it. I did like my TJ and will probably get another one day just to play with it, but as a DD there is no comparison. The 3.8 is not as bad as people make it out to be. At the end of the day a Wrangler is still a Wrangler, enjoy whichever one you own.
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Old 07-15-2015, 07:16 AM   #13
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Trade in, heck no!

You can get a lot more money for a well conditioned TJ if you sell it yourself!

The dealer will low ball you on your TJ trade-in, and then will sell it for several thousand dollars over what he will give you for your traded in TJ.

I would only consider trading a TJ for a brand new JK, provided you live in a state that gives you a tax advantage on a new Jeep purchase, when trading in a vehicle...

Man, I really do miss my old TJ. It is the only vehicle I ever regretted selling.

Option 2 would be to keep the TJ and buy a JK...

GL/Cheers,

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Old 07-15-2015, 08:50 AM   #14
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Nope, first of all I don't like the looks of JKs AT ALL, I'd buy a car over a JK for that reason alone. Plus I'd have to spend the money to update my scan tool (it's good through 2007 now), and I prefer simpler vehicles to more complex.

I'd trade my '06 TJ Rubicon for a late-model (external slave) YJ w/4.0l, AX15, SYE, D44s, w/4.56 or 4.88, quality 4" lift, and 33s, though.
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Old 07-15-2015, 09:47 AM   #15
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Did he say even trade? I read trade in
He didn't specify. I assumed he meant even trade, title for title. If that's not the case then no, I wouldn't trade it into a dealer. The OP never specified a price difference so who knows what he meant?

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Originally Posted by rgreen65 View Post
I

As the driver of a 2003 with 117,000 miles, an 04 with only 49,000 miles on it is considered low mileage, an '09 with 49,000 not so much. If the 2009 has manual windows, consider this, you can lean over and roll the TJ passenger window up and down. In the 2009 Sahara, you would have power windows.

I have a friend who has a 1998 Sahara that is in very good condition. If he offered to trade it to my for my '03 Rubicon, I would have to seriously consider it. There is just something that is so balanced about the TJ Sahara.
49000 miles is still considered low mileage on an 09. That's about 8000 miles a year. I can and do lean over to roll down the windows on my JK all the time. Yes its a littler larger than a TJ but it's very doable.

And why on earth would you trade an 03 Rubicon for a 98 Sahara?

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Nope, first of all I don't like the looks of JKs AT ALL, I'd buy a car over a JK for that reason alone. Plus I'd have to spend the money to update my scan tool (it's good through 2007 now), and I prefer simpler vehicles to more complex.

I'd trade my '06 TJ Rubicon for a late-model (external slave) YJ w/4.0l, AX15, SYE, D44s, w/4.56 or 4.88, quality 4" lift, and 33s, though.
Good more JK's for us then I'm so glad I didn't need a 4" lift to run 33's.
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Old 07-15-2015, 10:00 AM   #16
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All this is my humble opinion
Had a 2001 TJ as my first Wrangler...couldn't get rid of it fast enough and almost swore off Wrangler's forever. It was fine off road, but my ATV was better on road. No kidding, during a rain storm as it struggled to go up Mount Eagle pass (almost was able to hold 40mph)and the floor filled with water and the roof started pouring, I pulled in at a rest area, called a tow truck and the dealer and demanded they pick me up.

Took 8 years for the loathing to fade and bought an 09 jk after test driving several times.So it would depend on driving habits. If you want a dedicated trail rig, keep the TJ...if you want something functional for daily commutes and off road, I much prefer the JK.
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Old 07-15-2015, 10:54 AM   #17
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Just waiting for the tj bashing to start so I can sit back and laugh at all the jk drivers lol subbed. Some facts though 4.0>the 3.8 and 3.6 in terms of longevity and all around use, the Tj is much simpler and easier to work on like a real jeep out to be, don't have to worry about being out in the rain with your top off, aftermarket support is huge and much cheaper, safe to say I cast my vote for the tj but I'm also biased and actually work on my own vehicles lol
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Old 07-15-2015, 11:16 AM   #18
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I'm so glad I didn't need a 4" lift to run 33's.
Serious question - why? I lift mine because ground clearance is more important than a LCOG where I wheel, but why don't you like a lift?
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Old 07-15-2015, 11:21 AM   #19
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the Tj is much simpler and easier to work on like a real jeep out to be
Maybe compared to a JK, but TJs are all OBD2 vehicles and therefore have a LOT to go wrong.

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don't have to worry about being out in the rain with your top off
Anything more than light rain is asking for trouble when water gets under the steering wheel and causes the clock spring to do funny things, and if you have a factory stereo it's not designed to continue working after getting wet.
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Old 07-15-2015, 11:32 AM   #20
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To answer the OP....

Probably not....but it depends on how you use the vehicle.

Your only DD? Maybe...but I might go with a different vehicle than an 09 JK.
Trail rig? Doubt it.
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Old 07-15-2015, 11:32 AM   #21
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don't have to worry about being out in the rain with your top off
Not sure where you are getting that from, my friends 04 just suffered a clock spring failure after a short rain.
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Old 07-15-2015, 11:33 AM   #22
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Maybe compared to a JK, but TJs are all OBD2 vehicles and therefore have a LOT to go wrong. Anything more than light rain is asking for trouble when water gets under the steering wheel and causes the clock spring to do funny things, and if you have a factory stereo it's not designed to continue working after getting wet.
well it's convenient we are comparing it to a jk then huh lol me and more than a few of my buddies with tjs have all been caught in downpour before yet our clock springs and radios, after markets and stockers, are all just fine yet the 2 jks that went with us wheeling that day both had radio issues from them on. And I've seen more than a few jk owners come to oreilleys with clock spring issues after raining than I have seen tjs, all just my experience and opinion
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Old 07-15-2015, 12:11 PM   #23
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Years back my wife and I took at TJ for a test drive. Took it out on the freeway and we thought it was the biggest piece of junk we had ever driven.

Ended up buying a new F-150, one of the best vehicles we have ever had.

275,000 miles on it when we traded it in. 5 speed with the original clutch and exhaust. Like all Fords, it went through alternators every 100,000 miles.

We were at the Chrysler dealership looking at buying a Journey. Took it out and it was pretty nice, but my wife said it's too much like a minivan.

Then she spots the Deep Cherry Red JKU Altitude. I said, remember the last time we drove a Wrangler. Forget it.

The saleman said, it's not the same vehicle. So we take it out and WOW!! This thing is pretty nice.

I told the guy we think about it.

Get a call from my wife the next day saying that she had just put a deposit on it and we are picking it up this weekend.

It's her daily driver and we don't off road. She just likes the looks. She always wanted a Hummer.

Only thing we have done to it is have a 2" lower kit installed. She busted up her leg pretty good a few years ago and had trouble getting in at the original height even with the step bars.

I kept all the original suspension parts so when it's time to sell it, that would go with it.

It actually looks good down a couple of inches. At least we think it does.
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Old 07-15-2015, 12:17 PM   #24
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[QUOTE="MarkyMark117;20269241"] well it's convenient we are comparing it to a jk then /QUOTE]

That's my point, they're both OBD2 vehicles and are therefore very similar as far as complexity. JKs may have some gadgets & features that TJs don't, but I'd say that as far as actual drivability problems TJs & JKs are pretty much dead even on the complexity level.
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Old 07-15-2015, 05:00 PM   #25
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Just waiting for the tj bashing to start so I can sit back and laugh at all the jk drivers lol subbed. Some facts though 4.0>the 3.8 and 3.6 in terms of longevity and all around use, the Tj is much simpler and easier to work on like a real jeep out to be, don't have to worry about being out in the rain with your top off, aftermarket support is huge and much cheaper, safe to say I cast my vote for the tj but I'm also biased and actually work on my own vehicles lol
I'm sorry us poor JK owners don't own "real jeeps". Maybe you don't get out much? Aftermarket support for JK's is insane. Try looking at aftermarket support for a Nissan Xterra and compare. It's also sad that you think JK owners don't work on their own vehicles. I work on mine and so do many others. Pretty easy to work on actually. Water pump took me a whole 30 minutes. Clockspring issue can happen on any vehicle with water intrusion. TJ or JK, the things we put our Jeeps through would cause other vehicles to be totaled out with "flood damage".

I like TJs a lot, I've thought about buying a TJ or YJ to play with offroad but my JK hasn't let me down yet so I keep on using it. I don't understand all the hatred for the JK in this thread at all.

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Serious question - why? I lift mine because ground clearance is more important than a LCOG where I wheel, but why don't you like a lift?
JK's don't require as much lift to accomplish the same goals. You can run 37's on a JK with a 4" lift. They are totally different animal. I like the fact that I can put the money for a 4" lift in my pocket and still run 33" tires and have the same if not more ground clearance than a TJ. We don't need to do any kind of "belly up" mods either.

TJ's and JK's are both great Jeeps. They are very different, but still the same bloodline. No reason to hate on one or the other.

Also the 3.8 bashing on this site in general is pretty bad. The 3.8 is a perfectly fine engine. Yes the 3.6 is superior, and Jeep has probably sold more 3.6 equipped Wranglers than 3.8's at this point, but that doesn't mean the 3.8 is junk. Most people that talk shit about the 3.8 have never even driven one.
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Old 07-15-2015, 06:18 PM   #26
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Just waiting for the tj bashing to start so I can sit back and laugh at all the jk drivers lol subbed. Some facts though 4.0>the 3.8 and 3.6 in terms of longevity and all around use, the Tj is much simpler and easier to work on like a real jeep out to be, don't have to worry about being out in the rain with your top off, aftermarket support is huge and much cheaper, safe to say I cast my vote for the tj but I'm also biased and actually work on my own vehicles lol
Another case of someone thinking what they have is the best simply because it is what THEY have or like.


I have been around and driven countless Jeeps in various moded forms. I love a TJ but I would never have a jeep with a 4.0 if I have my choice. I have seen so many of them starve for oil on steep climbs it is not funny. I have done 4 wheel drive drag races on flat ground and up hills and have yet to be beat by one in my "junky" 3.8, even when I have lined up my 6000lb JK on 37's up against a 4.0 on 33's with 4.58 gears. Toss a heavy set of beadlocks and tires on a 4.0 and take off down the interstate or hill country and tell me how much you love it.


The longest I recall a 4.0 lasting with anyone that I personally know is around 180k but I know of sever 3.8s in other vehicles go way over 200k as long as you keep oil in them (know lots of 4.0s that go threw oil also). Heck my exwifes 3.8 had 300k on the clock when the cats cloged up and burnt it to the ground and that bitch never checked or changed the oil.

The JKs are also easy to work on, I have turned almost every single bolt there is to turn on one along with working on TJs YJs ,XJs and a CJ or two. And lets not forget how much better the axles are.

Granted this is only stuff based on my personal experience, not something that I read about on the oll interwebs.

Funny how someone starts a post stating they cant wait to see the bashers so they can laugh at them and then start bashing the next sentence.
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Old 07-15-2015, 06:52 PM   #27
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Just waiting for the tj bashing to start so I can sit back and laugh at all the jk drivers lol subbed. Some facts though 4.0>the 3.8 and 3.6 in terms of longevity and all around use, the Tj is much simpler and easier to work on like a real jeep out to be, don't have to worry about being out in the rain with your top off, aftermarket support is huge and much cheaper, safe to say I cast my vote for the tj but I'm also biased and actually work on my own vehicles lol
love the TJ but I think some of your arguments "facts" are biased. Longevity will need to be determined yet. The 3.6 has only been around for four years or so. So comparing it for longevity with an engine that's been around for 30 years or so is not an equal comparison. I could say statistically more 4.0 engines have failed than 3.6L... Statistically accurate to make the 3.6L sound better. But this too is not an accurate comparison, but more of an example how statistics can be manipulated. I'm not sure how the TJ is much simpler to work on than the JK. Your average shade tree mechanic will understand all the basics and be able to replace all the basics I.e. Water pump, starter, alternator, belts, hoses, radiator, etc. these things aren't suddenly foreign objects that none of us recognize. It's just as easy as a TJ. Oil changes the thing we'll be doing the most is much much easier in a 3.6 JK. The suspension is virtually the same design and therefore just as easy to work on. Four wheel disk brakes are easier than drum brakes. So I'm not sure where your getting this super simple TJ. Your TJ has a clock spring (unlike my YJ that would sit out all summer in the rain) and is also subject to problems. The Jk I rented in Hawaii got rained in almost everyday for two weeks with no ill effects. Your aftermarket support statement is actually funny. The aftermarket follows the money. With 3x + as many JK's on the road than TJ's it stands to reason that aftermarket accessories will be geared towards the larger market. Aftermarket repair parts may be larger for the TJ as they age and need more replacement parts. But most new development of bumpers, fenders, armor and such are going to the Jk, also from a longevity standpoint with the large amount of JK's produced there will be a larger supply of used parts to keep them going longer.
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Old 07-15-2015, 08:39 PM   #28
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JK's don't require as much lift to accomplish the same goals.
Where does the extra wheel travel come from? Are the wheel openings just that much bigger and the fenders just that much higher? I've spent very little time around JKs, only 1 person I know who owns one ever takes it wheelin'. Of course, more than a few TJ owners that I know never leave pavement or hard packed dirt roads, either.

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TJ's and JK's are both great Jeeps. They are very different, but still the same bloodline. No reason to hate on one or the other.
I've owned an '83 CJ, I have a '90 YJ, and I'm on my 2nd TJ (had a '73 Wagoneer, too), and the worst one off-road was the CJ. 2.72s and tiny little tires will do that. 2-piece axle shafts that spun their flanges when a spinning wheel was stopped abruptly didn't help, either. The one that surprised me most was my bone stock '00 Sahara, that thing would go almost anywhere except deep mud. The trend seems to be for each successive generation to become more capable than the previous both on & off road, and if I just didn't find JKs so HIDEOUS I would have looked for one instead of my '06 Rubi! Plus they look like they're as wide as a GD full size pickup! To be clear, I'm hating on the appearance and not the Jeep itself LOL. I'll wheel with anyone who doesn't drive a shitbox that won't ever make it through a trail without breaking, so JK, XJ, ZJ, or even Liberties, let's go!
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Old 07-15-2015, 08:50 PM   #29
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I'm on my second JK and although both of them have been OK, I still have my '03 TJ and I hope to God that I never have to let it go.
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Old 07-16-2015, 02:39 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Espo78 View Post
And why on earth would you trade an 03 Rubicon for a 98 Sahara?
I didn't say I would definitely trade, I said I would have to consider it. It is in immaculate condition although I don't know the mileage and what it like underneath. Hand down, I probably would not, because it is a HT and Auto. For the same reason when I was shopping in March, the Rubicon on the lot was below the 3 Saharas I wanted to look at, one White and two in Anvil. The salesman even asked me if I wanted to look at the Rubicon after the test drive in the Sahara. I replied that I had one, didn't need a second. Same thing applies to the 98 Sahara.

I can't drive the Rubicon every day because Arthur is starting to get me and on joint that is bothering me on occasion is my left ankle. That and a clutch don't go together well every day. But it much more fun to drive on good days than the '15 Sahara.

__________________
2003 Light Khaki TJ Rubicon, Manual, Soft Top
2015 Anvil JKU Sahara, Auto, Hard Top - Traded
2017 Chief JKU Chief, Auto, Hard Top
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