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Old 12-09-2019, 09:32 AM
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Big Brother is watching!

I took the JL off-road yesterday for the first time. Upon getting on the trail I aired down for obvious reasons.

When I got home I found my Jeep had sent a stern Vehicle Alert to my Gmail account! --see below. The report lists the pressure on each tire, the exact mileage of the Jeep at that moment and oil life remaining. Thankfully it didn't report where I was or with whom!

Hmmm...not sure what to think about this: be uncomfortable with this level of intrusion, or resigned to the sign of things to come...



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Old 12-09-2019, 09:46 AM   #2
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The good news is ..... it Stops once the FREE period is over and you opt to Not pay some ridiculous monthly fee to keep up the nanny-grams.

* I did use the cool functions like twice in a year. Flash the lights from half a mile away to find the Jeep at a PSU game, Lock the doors from inside restaurants when I wasn't quite sure if I did or not.

FYI FCA: I probably would have kept the subscription going for a $$ that was commensurate with perceived value, perhaps consider a multi-tier membership.
or not
At the asking price - Not worth it.
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Old 12-09-2019, 10:11 AM
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Yeah. This is the 2nd similar alert I have received in one month. Not liking it. Even for free.

Interestingly, the LSD clutches were smelling when I hit deep snow.* Yet I don't see that anywhere on this report.

It seems FCA is happy to have these reports point the finger at things that are the owner's responsibility, but omits issues that will cost FCA money to fix under warranty.

*Selec-Trac performed flawless getting to the trail, and Jeep's 4WD system did its job on the trail as expected. But I was disappointed with the LSD; it started smelling as soon as conditions got a bit challenging. This is the first time I use a clutch-actuated LSD; my prior Saharas had aftermarket TrueTrac, which uses helical gears instead of cluthes, and therefore is much tougher and durable. I would say the stock LSD is JL's weak link in an otherwise excellent off-road vehicle. Can't wait for someone to develop an aftermarket alternative.
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Old 12-09-2019, 10:18 AM   #4
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Wow! I'm not a fan of new vehicle technology.

I just went out to my shop and gave my TJ a hug!
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Old 12-09-2019, 10:22 AM   #5
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All I can say is 20psi isn't really airing down, especially if it was for snow.

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Old 12-09-2019, 10:29 AM   #6
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All I can say is 20psi isn't really airing down, especially if it was for snow.

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I agree 20psi is not really doing much other than softening the ride on a forest service road.
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Old 12-09-2019, 10:33 AM   #7
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Yeah. This is the 2nd similar alert I have received in one month. Not liking it. Even for free.

Interestingly, the LSD clutches were smelling when I hit deep snow.* Yet I don't see that anywhere on this report.

It seems FCA is happy to have these reports point the finger at things that are the owner's responsibility, but omits issues that will cost FCA money to fix under warranty.

*Selec-Trac performed flawless getting to the trail, and Jeep's 4WD system did its job on the trail as expected. But I was disappointed with the LSD; it started smelling as soon as conditions got a bit challenging. This is the first time I use a clutch-actuated LSD; my prior Saharas had aftermarket TrueTrac, which uses helical gears instead of cluthes, and therefore is much tougher and durable. I would say the stock LSD is JL's weak link in an otherwise excellent off-road vehicle. Can't wait for someone to develop an aftermarket alternative.
that is really odd I wonder if it was not your brakes you were smelling? Or just the newness of the vehicle. Reason I say that is I have put a lot of miles on in the snow and offroad with LSD on my 2013 sport and it never caused a smell and my buddy has LSD in his 2014 and we have done a lot of snow wheeling together as well as have been to Moab several times together and his has never smelled, his did however break his spider gears but I think he was at like 60,000 miles when that happened. Watching his I was always impressed how quick he would hook up.
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Old 12-09-2019, 11:46 AM   #8
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The electronic world is taken over. Just watch some of the Artificial Intelligence, Robotic shows on television. The PHD's say there is a chance that they may take over the world, and tell us what to do. This is no joke, Elon Musk is one of them saying this..
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Old 12-09-2019, 11:54 AM   #9
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The electronic world is taken over. Just watch some of the Artificial Intelligence, Robotic shows on television. The PHD's say there is a chance that they may take over the world, and tell us what to do. This is no joke, Elon Musk is one of them saying this..
You need some Old Glory insurance
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:05 PM   #10
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The good news is ..... it Stops once the FREE period is over and you opt to Not pay some ridiculous monthly fee to keep up the nanny-grams.

* I did use the cool functions like twice in a year. Flash the lights from half a mile away to find the Jeep at a PSU game, Lock the doors from inside restaurants when I wasn't quite sure if I did or not.

FYI FCA: I probably would have kept the subscription going for a $$ that was commensurate with perceived value, perhaps consider a multi-tier membership.
or not
At the asking price - Not worth it.
The nanny-grams stop to YOUR e-mail, but I'll bet a nickle the BCC's continue being sent to FCA about every aspect of your vehicle, whether or not you pay for the service. Sure loven my JK's right about now.
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:15 PM
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that is really odd I wonder if it was not your brakes you were smelling? Or just the newness of the vehicle. Reason I say that is I have put a lot of miles on in the snow and offroad with LSD on my 2013 sport and it never caused a smell and my buddy has LSD in his 2014 and we have done a lot of snow wheeling together as well as have been to Moab several times together and his has never smelled, his did however break his spider gears but I think he was at like 60,000 miles when that happened. Watching his I was always impressed how quick he would hook up.
It was definitely the stench of burning clutch. Never had this happen with TrueTracs.

Like you said, I am hoping it is because the Jeep is new...!
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:16 PM   #12
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The nanny-grams stop to YOUR e-mail, but I'll bet a nickle the BCC's continue being sent to FCA about every aspect of your vehicle, whether or not you pay for the service. Sure loven my JK's right about now.
Oh, I agree. I love Both my JK and my JL But I do Not delude myself into thinking (really) either vehicle tracks all aspects of telemetry.
The JL was just more noticeable for a year.
They can "look see" at anything we do to (or undo) with our Jeeps.
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:18 PM
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All I can say is 20psi isn't really airing down, especially if it was for snow.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
I aired down to 20 for the forest road part; then aired down to 15 when the trail got trickier and the snow appeared.

Thankfully I didn’t get two emails! LOL!!!
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:26 PM
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You need some Old Glory insurance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4Gh_IcK8UM


Reminded me of this other SNL skit: The Toilet Death Ejector

(watch at your own risk)
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Old 12-09-2019, 12:55 PM
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that is really odd I wonder if it was not your brakes you were smelling? Or just the newness of the vehicle. Reason I say that is I have put a lot of miles on in the snow and offroad with LSD on my 2013 sport and it never caused a smell and my buddy has LSD in his 2014 and we have done a lot of snow wheeling together as well as have been to Moab several times together and his has never smelled, his did however break his spider gears but I think he was at like 60,000 miles when that happened. Watching his I was always impressed how quick he would hook up.
Hmmm...now you got me thinking if the stench was really the LSD clutches as I assumed, or the BDL brakes...

It was getting icy, slippery, narrow and steep; I should have engaged 4-Lo to deactivate the ESC and the BDL!




I’m going to have to try it again...
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Old 12-09-2019, 01:05 PM   #16
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I think you'll find that is the case.
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Old 12-09-2019, 01:16 PM   #17
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Anytime something smells "stinky" it usually gets blamed on.... me.

It would be nice to Blame the BLD/ECM/TSC/ABS/LSD - instead
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Old 12-09-2019, 02:57 PM   #18
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I took the JL off-road yesterday for the first time. Upon getting on the trail I aired down for obvious reasons.

When I got home I found my Jeep had sent a stern Vehicle Alert to my Gmail account! --see below. The report lists the pressure on each tire, the exact mileage of the Jeep at that moment and oil life remaining. Thankfully it didn't report where I was or with whom!

Hmmm...not sure what to think about this: be uncomfortable with this level of intrusion, or resigned to the sign of things to come...

I had the exact same reaction when I was getting email alerts after I changed tires an the new pressure sensors had not caught up yet, was not at all happy with that tracking and would like to turn it off.
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Old 12-09-2019, 02:58 PM   #19
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Hmmm...now you got me thinking if the stench was really the LSD clutches as I assumed, or the BDL brakes...

It was getting icy, slippery, narrow and steep; I should have engaged 4-Lo to deactivate the ESC and the BDL!


I’m going to have to try it again...
Since you have Selec-Trac, it could also potentially be the clutches in your transfer case.
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Old 12-09-2019, 03:27 PM   #20
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The LSD clutches are enclosed in the diff case and bathed in oil treated with friction modifier.. Can't see how the clutches would give off a smell. If it did, it would have to seep out the vent tube.

I have a JK. When it was still relatively new (under 100 miles), I took it through some deep snow with all the nanny traction stuff turned on. Although I never touched the brakes, I could smell the strong odor of hot brake lining. It was caused by the brake lock differential which applies the brakes to the wheels that spin (those with the least traction). Since the JL also has BLD, this could have been what you were smelling...

As the pads have worn down, my BLD action no longer creates this burning smell.
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Old 12-09-2019, 03:47 PM   #21
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It is kind of amazing how much technology is in vehicles. My F 150 suggested to me the other day that I was tired and should stop for coffee.
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Old 12-09-2019, 04:23 PM
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Since you have Selec-Trac, it could also potentially be the clutches in your transfer case.
I had Selec-Trac on “Auto” mode on the road driving there. Switched to Part-Time “4-Hi” as I hit the trail; at that point the 4WD behaves like that on any other Wrangler.

I never engaged “4-Lo.” In hindsight I should have, if for no other reason to prevent the ESC to over-reacting.
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Old 12-09-2019, 04:27 PM
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The LSD clutches are enclosed in the diff case and bathed in oil treated with friction modifier.. Can't see how the clutches would give off a smell. If it did, it would have to seep out the vent tube.

I have a JK. When it was still relatively new (under 100 miles), I took it through some deep snow with all the nanny traction stuff turned on. Although I never touched the brakes, I could smell the strong odor of hot brake lining. It was caused by the brake lock differential which applies the brakes to the wheels that spin (those with the least traction). Since the JL also has BLD, this could have been what you were smelling...

As the pads have worn down, my BLD action no longer creates this burning smell.
These are good tips. Thanks.

Between the realization that the smell may have been the BLD due to operator error —by not engaging 4-Lo; and the possibility that it may be simply the coating on new brake lines, I am feeling a lot better.

I’ve been off-roading for years and never experienced this before.
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Old 12-09-2019, 04:31 PM
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It is kind of amazing how much technology is in vehicles. My F 150 suggested to me the other day that I was tired and should stop for coffee.
Indeed. German automakers have been experimenting with scanners that check our retinas to detect exhaustion.

Gawd, I think I’d freak out if my Jeep ever told me to pull over and have a coffee...or told my insurer that I was driving tired!

Of course this being a Fiat, would have to be a double espresso and a biscotti...!
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Old 12-09-2019, 04:40 PM   #25
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I was driving down the road once .... and I hear " You are a stupid PIA and I never liked you since the first day I met you - Pull over"
Turns out it wasn't the car.
My mother-in-law was in the back seat.

I just kept driving and jumped out when I slowed to about 15 mph.
Not sure what happened - it was her car.
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Old 12-09-2019, 05:32 PM   #26
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I had Selec-Trac on “Auto” mode on the road driving there. Switched to Part-Time “4-Hi” as I hit the trail; at that point the 4WD behaves like that on any other Wrangler.

I never engaged “4-Lo.” In hindsight I should have, if for no other reason to prevent the ESC to over-reacting.
The clutch packs are not only used in “Auto” mode though, that’s all Selec-Trac has to use. Yes, 4-Hi splits power 50/50 like any other Wrangler, but it doesn’t mechanically engage it the same like the others.

The MP3022 “locks” the clutch packs for the 50/50 distribution (vs chain & gearset that the NV241/241OR use). So a lot of long, continuous wheel spin (snow, sand) in 4-HI could potentially overheat the clutches which would simply disengage 4WD altogether.

You’d see a “Service 4WD” message with trouble code C1477 - Transfer Case Clutch Over Temperature
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Old 12-09-2019, 06:26 PM
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The clutch packs are not only used in “Auto” mode though, that’s all Selec-Trac has to use. Yes, 4-Hi splits power 50/50 like any other Wrangler, but it doesn’t mechanically engage it the same like the others.

The MP3022 “locks” the clutch packs for the 50/50 distribution (vs chain & gearset that the NV241/241OR use). So a lot of long, continuous wheel spin (snow, sand) in 4-HI could potentially overheat the clutches which would simply disengage 4WD altogether.

You’d see a “Service 4WD” message with trouble code C1477 - Transfer Case Clutch Over Temperature
That’s good to know. Thanks.

Thankfully there was no “Service 4WD” message on my dashboard —or my email!

Note self: don’t forget to engage 4-Lo next time...
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Old 12-09-2019, 06:42 PM   #28
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Old 12-09-2019, 07:46 PM
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The clutch packs are not only used in “Auto” mode though, that’s all Selec-Trac has to use. Yes, 4-Hi splits power 50/50 like any other Wrangler, but it doesn’t mechanically engage it the same like the others.

The MP3022 “locks” the clutch packs for the 50/50 distribution (vs chain & gearset that the NV241/241OR use). So a lot of long, continuous wheel spin (snow, sand) in 4-HI could potentially overheat the clutches which would simply disengage 4WD altogether.

You’d see a “Service 4WD” message with trouble code C1477 - Transfer Case Clutch Over Temperature
From what I recall, the Selec-Trac on my 1995 and 2001 Grand Cherokees used a viscous coupling to engage 4WD automatically: as a wheel spun faster the viscous coupling got thicker, "engaging" the 4WD.

From what you are saying, the new Selec-Trac uses clutches instead of such viscous coupling?
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Old 12-09-2019, 07:51 PM   #30
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From what you are saying, the new Selec-Trac uses clutches instead of such viscous coupling?
Correct.
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