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Discussion Starter #1
Just curious to what the cost would like be if I was to change my gears from 3.21 to 4.10 after parts and labor. I figure at least a grand, but don't think I am willing to go too much above $1500. Has anybody went to 4.10 from 3.21 and how much did it cost? I figure much more people have went to 4.56 instead of 4.10s.

I won't be getting new tires for a few years, but when I do it will be 33's with spacers. Currently running 32s, but my steel rear and front bumper help sag me down. The 3.21s are acceptable but I live in a hilly area and I much rather go with the performance, I can afford it. I plan to keep this Jeep forever, and even if I don't 4.10s on a Sport would really help with the sale.

Thanks for any help
 

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You will need R&P's, front carrier, Master Installation kits, plus oil.
The labor will vary by area, but a max of $1,800 should cover it.........:thumb:

Make sure that you get the warranty in writing, from the install shop!!!!!!!!!!
Also make sure that you use a experienced shop, for this MOD!!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I looked up 4.10 threads before but never seen an estimated cost. Thanks for the responses guy, I will be very happy for that price and I will ensure to get the warranty in writing. Next up I need to find a good shop.
 

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Based on my research I my area (central Indiana )... Labor runs about $1200-1300. 4.10 gears + master install kits about $1000. Plus you would need a carrier ( think locker or tru-trac ) which will add to that. 4.56 will save you a couple hundred due to gears being cheaper. But either way you look it's not a cheap deal. Labor rates vary and many folks claim they pay less. I did not find that to be the case in my area. But the parts costs are pretty much the same

I might suggest swapping axles. I'm swapping my 3.73's for some 4.10 Rubicon axles with lockers. I found brand new for about what I would have paid for labor, gears and lockers. And swapping is something I can do instead of having to pay someone, plus hopefully I can sell my 3.73 axles and recoup some back

If you're staying with 33's I would know a guy that could make you a deal on a pair of 3.73 axles with factory lsd. ;-)
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I might suggest swapping axles. I'm swapping my 3.73's for some 4.10 Rubicon axles with lockers. I found brand new for about what I would have paid for labor, gears and lockers. And swapping is something I can do instead of having to pay someone, plus hopefully I can sell my 3.73 axles and recoup some back
So, if I bought a D44 Rubicon Front axle that comes with the 4.10s aswell? (If I'm reading that correctly, I would also assume that some come with 3.73 and not just 4.10s. Probably would take some searching to get.)

I do intend on running this rig forever, when it is not my daily driver it will be my incredibly fun 2nd vehicle that I use for fishing and commuting in shitty winter conditions. I don't have LSD so at some point I will add a aftermarket one, and given I can afford it I want to upgrade gears ASAP. Though 3.73 isn't worth the price IMO especially if I was to upgrade to 35 inch tires.
 

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So, if I bought a D44 Rubicon Front axle that comes with the 4.10s aswell? (If I'm reading that correctly, I would also assume that some come with 3.73 and not just 4.10s. Probably would take some searching to get.)

I do intend on running this rig forever, when it is not my daily driver it will be my incredibly fun 2nd vehicle that I use for fishing and commuting in shitty winter conditions. I don't have LSD so at some point I will add a aftermarket one, and given I can afford it I want to upgrade gears ASAP. Though 3.73 isn't worth the price IMO especially if I was to upgrade to 35 inch tires.
If you are thinking possibly 35's in the future, then go to the 4.56 ratio.IMO
In other words, do it right the first time!!!!!!!!!
 

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So, if I bought a D44 Rubicon Front axle that comes with the 4.10s aswell? (If I'm reading that correctly, I would also assume that some come with 3.73 and not just 4.10s. Probably would take some searching to get.)

I do intend on running this rig forever, when it is not my daily driver it will be my incredibly fun 2nd vehicle that I use for fishing and commuting in shitty winter conditions. I don't have LSD so at some point I will add a aftermarket one, and given I can afford it I want to upgrade gears ASAP. Though 3.73 isn't worth the price IMO especially if I was to upgrade to 35 inch tires.
Yes Rubicon axles are in 3.73 & 4.10 gear ratios. You can find them on Ebay with 4.10. The Rubicons with manual trannys come stock with 4.10, if you have an auto, it's an option with an upcharge.
As far as LSD or locker, you'll want to do that when you re gear, because you'll pay the labor rate again down the road if you want to add it, so it's best to do it the first time.

If you are thinking possibly 35's in the future, then go to the 4.56 ratio.IMO
In other words, do it right the first time!!!!!!!!!
I agree mostly, but this applies particularly if you are looking at re gearing. If re gearing your existing axles, and you have an auto transmission with plans to run 35's, go straight to 4.56. If you're looking at an axle swap, then 4.10's certainly get you in the acceptable range as plenty of people here can attest. It probably comes down to economics and that's a question only you can answer. Because I run a manual transmission, I am dead set on 4.10's, this helps make the economic case for axle swap vs. a re gear & lockers.

If you have an auto, then 4.56 is the way to go if you want 35's. If you look at Derf's Gear Ratio Calculator You'll see that the 6 speed manual transmission with 3.73's matches the 4.56/auto almost gear for gear in 1-5. And really it's not a bad setup at all. (says the man with 3.73's going to 4.10 :) ) My personal opinion is that the 6 speed with 3.73's & 35's is just slightly too tall in 6th gear. My hope is the 4.10's will get me over the edge, and the addition of lockers will be icing on the cake. But if I were running 33's, I wouldn't bother to change it.
 

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You'll see that the 6 speed manual transmission with 3.73's matches the 4.56/auto almost gear for gear in 1-5.
The auto transmission has the benefit of a torque converter that will not only automatically "slip" for you at low RPMs, but also actually multiplies torque when "slipping".

Comparing an auto and manual with the same overall gearing in 1st gear, the auto will more easily get moving from a stop, and will more easily crawl slowly off road.

The gear ratio chart for the 3.6 Wrangler even recommends numerically higher axle ratios for the manual transmission:

 

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The auto transmission has the benefit of a torque converter that will not only automatically "slip" for you at low RPMs, but also actually multiplies torque when "slipping".

Comparing an auto and manual with the same overall gearing in 1st gear, the auto will more easily get moving from a stop, and will more easily crawl slowly off road.

The gear ratio chart for the 3.6 Wrangler even recommends numerically higher axle ratios for the manual transmission:
I completely agree with this, having driven both 6 speed and auto i definitely notice improper gearing on manuals much more than on auto.
Sure a manual you can hold a lower gear on road but off road your clutch will HATE you!
I had a 3.6l 6sp with 33's and 3.73 gears and off road was just tolerable, meanwhile a 3.8L auto with 4.10's and 37's was easier to live with.
Just my $.02.
 

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I want to make sure that I am understanding this right. I currently have 3.21's and hate it! I drive around 40 miles a day on highway and 6th gear is absolutely useless. So if I stayed with the same gears and just upgraded my axles from d35 to d44 then it would help give it more power in 6th gear or would upgrading gears be the way to go? Sorry if I sound clueless, but I have no mechanical knowledge at all.
 

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I want to make sure that I am understanding this right. I currently have 3.21's and hate it! I drive around 40 miles a day on highway and 6th gear is absolutely useless. So if I stayed with the same gears and just upgraded my axles from d35 to d44 then it would help give it more power in 6th gear or would upgrading gears be the way to go? Sorry if I sound clueless, but I have no mechanical knowledge at all.
Unless you have an early 2007 JK you will already have a Dana 44 and not a Dana 35. In the rear at least.

The difference between those axles is how much weight they can carry and how strong the axle shafts are.

The front axle is either a Dana 30 or a Dana 44. The Rubicon gets the 44. However, it's not much stronger than the Dana 30 because outside of the differential housing and the axle shafts, they're pretty much the same.

That being said, swapping a Rubicon front 44 in place of a 30 is still an upgrade. You'll get 3.73 or, more likely, 4.10 gears as well as a locker. You will need either the matching rear axle or you can regear what you have. The gear ratios have to match if you actually want to use 4wd.


But to answer your question about the swap, you need to change gears to make 6th gear useful. You can do that with the axles you already have. Swapping axles with the same gears won't do anything to change how the Jeep drives. Swapping an axle with the same gears would still leave 6th gear as useless as a fat kid in a dodgeball game.

I had 3.21's in my 2012. I didn't even bother with 6th gear. When I went to 35's I swapped gears at the same time and I went with 4.56's. Now 6th gear is great for highway cruising in the flat lands. Had I known at the time that I was going to be moving to the mountains I probably would have gone with 4.88's. Still, 4.56's aren't terrible. They're adequate but not ideal.
 

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Okay, so in order to do this properly, I would need to swap both front and rears axles out to rubicon 44s with 4.10s or the front one and switch to 4.10s in rear? I'm not mechanically inclined at all.
 

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Depends what you want. Do you want rubicon axles with lockers? And do you want 4.10 gears? If so, then swapping in rubicon axles will get you what you want. If you just want 4.10 gears and don't want the rubicon axles/lockers, then just re-gear. If you don't care whether you have rubicon axles/lockers or not, then price out both options and pick whichever is cheaper. If you only want a locker up front, then consider swapping in a a rubicon axle up front and re-gearing the back. While you're paying for the labor to re-gear the rear, it would be cost-effective to add a LSD in the rear at the same time (if you want LSD in the rear).

If you don't understand what lockers and LSDs are, or don't know if you want them, then you need to do some research and learn about what they are, what they do, and what type of driving they are beneficial for.

Also, don't choose to get a rubicon axle up front just because someone says the D44 is better than the D30. Do you even use your vehicle in a way that you need additional strength in the front axle?
 

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Okay, so in order to do this properly, I would need to swap both front and rears axles out to rubicon 44s with 4.10s or the front one and switch to 4.10s in rear? I'm not mechanically inclined at all.
Start here to further understand gearing being matched to tire size: Regearing Basics

Next, go here to read up on the different types of differentials and traction aiding devices: The Basics of Differentials and Lockers

That will give you a good overview without specifically trying to push you in any particular direction.

As far as where to go from here with your Jeep, the first thing you need to decide is where you want to end up. The second thing you need to know is how much money you're willing to spend to get there.

Swapping in Rubicon axles is one way to go. It gets you gears and selectable lockers in a package that more or less bolts up to your Jeep. You just need to supply the switches and wiring to operate the lockers. But finding used Rubicon axles may be a challenge, especially if you want them in good shape.

Alternatively, you can do a few things to the axles you already have. A shop can install new gears and lockers into your existing axles. You can have a shop weld some reinforcement pieces onto your front axle to strengthen it a bit (which is a good idea for either the Dana 30 or Rubicon Dana 44). The Dana 30 gears and axle shafts are still weaker than the Dana 44 but properly set up the Dana 30 will handle 35" tires without exploding.

You can buy brand new Rubicon axles from a dealership but they're not cheap. I would recommend you avoid this route. If you're going to spend the money on new axles, you can do better than factory Rubicons. For around the same money you can buy some aftermarket axles that are dramatically stronger than the factory axles. And you can get them with whatever gear ratio you want and whatever locker you want. You have to grab a few pieces off your Dana 30 but it's easy to grab what you need and swap it over in a weekend.
 
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