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Discussion Starter #1
The question is simple as that, do I need to purchase a high steer kit on a 3 inch BDS Suspension lift kit? I have the AEV Geo correction brackets I will be installing with the kit, this is my daily driver! From what I have read at 3.5 it is a must, but at 3 it is hit and miss if you do need one or not and what are its benifits?

Thanks for all the helps guys!:iamhappy:

P.S. I have a 4 door JKUR. Only mods on it now are JCR rock rails and Rock Hard 4x4 Engine/Oil Pan and Transmission skid plate!
 

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At 3" I like to use an adjustable track bar. At 3.5 it's 50/50 and at 4" I would put on a drag link flip and track bar relocation bracket. Just my humble opinion.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
At 3" I like to use an adjustable track bar. At 3.5 it's 50/50 and at 4" I would put on a drag link flip and track bar relocation bracket. Just my humble opinion.
ok, now I think the bds kit comes with drop brackets or whatever brackets correct those, would it still be worth it to buy the adjustable track bar? What is a good bang for your buck item? Also how does it benifit you, I don't mess with track bars often!
 

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I put a 3" bds lift on my wife's jk. A high steer kit is not needed. It comes with a relocation bracket for the rear track bar but nothing for the front. I installed bds (wouldn't recommend these for anything other than a mall crawler) adjustable track bars front and rear because I'm anal about the axles being centered not because they're a must have.
 

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ok, now I think the bds kit comes with drop brackets or whatever brackets correct those, would it still be worth it to buy the adjustable track bar? What is a good bang for your buck item? Also how does it benifit you, I don't mess with track bars often!
As you lift, your front axle will shift towards the drivers side of the Jeep and is not centered. Below 2.5 it's not too noticeable. But at 3" I would put it on to center up the front axle.

I like the JKS, it was recently updated and is a great piece.
 

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As Keeper said, drive it and see how it feel to "you".

There are no hard thresholds on what is needed within 1/2" increments of lift. A 3" lift can generate 4" of lift (as might be the case on your JK since you don't have a lot extra hardware) in some cases and just 3" depending on the configuration of your Jeep. Besides everyone's sensitivity to bump steer, low Caster angle, coil high spring rate, dislocation of the instant center, additional roll and poor scrub radius is different. It's just like some folks are fine with 3.21 gears and 35" tires. Drive it and adjust accordingly.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I put a 3" bds lift on my wife's jk. A high steer kit is not needed. It comes with a relocation bracket for the rear track bar but nothing for the front. I installed bds (wouldn't recommend these for anything other than a mall crawler) adjustable track bars front and rear because I'm anal about the axles being centered not because they're a must have.
Do you mean the bds lift in general or just bds adjustable track bars?

Ok I will get a good drive to see the feel for it this afternoon, I'm headed back to school at carson newman near knoxville! What should I look out for to feel that the axle is not centered right?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Why do a flip for the sake of doing it ?
Get a feel for how it drives. Only if you're having issues wIth bumpsteer install a flip.

A adjustable track bar will center the axle. If you were to run a track bar bracket with a drag link flip, you would not need a adjustable track bar at 3" of lift.
Is a drag link flip am easy mod?
 

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You JK guys are silly.....'lifting' the Jeep won't cause bump steer. Bump steer is caused by an unparallel condition between the drag link and track bar pivot points. Assuming you install 3" springs, the track bar and drag link frame-end pivot points go up together the same amount.....still parallel. ;)
 

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No bump steer issue for me, if I change 1 I'm changing the other, The track bar and drag link angle become pretty steep on higher lifts and this can induce a little bit of harshness in the suspension. Plus the axle shift during suspension travel becomes more exaggerated and I would rather clean it up with a rather simple mod.
 

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You JK guys are silly.....'lifting' the Jeep won't cause bump steer. Bump steer is caused by an unparallel condition between the drag link and track bar pivot points. Assuming you install 3" springs, the track bar and drag link frame-end pivot points go up together the same amount.....still parallel. ;)
There's a site that I won't mention. A high steer kit is highly recommended anytime a jeep is lifted over 3".
I recommend it only If needed.

I can't say I had bad bumpsteer but the steering wheel would seesaw more without it. The jeep just handles better with flip and roll center correction :thumb:
 

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There's a site that I won't mention. A high steer kit is highly recommended anytime a jeep is lifted over 3".
I recommend it only If needed.

I can't say I had bad bumpsteer but the steering wheel would seesaw more without it. The jeep just handles better with flip and roll center correction :thumb:
Of course it handles better with a higher roll center. But bump steer was never a problem.

JK owners have been conditioned to believe they've got problems they don't have so that manufacturers can sell more parts. Having a better fundamental understanding of how this stuff works would serve many of you well....at least then you'd be able to navigate through the many metric tons of BS out there.
 

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Of course it handles better with a higher roll center. But bump steer was never a problem. JK owners have been conditioned to believe they've got problems they don't have so that manufacturers can sell more parts. Having a better fundamental understanding of how this stuff works would serve many of you well....at least then you'd be able to navigate through the many metric tons of BS out there.
Not JKO .. Welcome to the Internet :)
 

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When I said "JK owners" I wasn't referring to JKO....

KJ, people in this section respect what you have to say. Make sure you're not just repeating marketing BS with no technical grounding. Do yourself and others a favor and dig into the finer points of suspension and steering so that your advice is always correct.
 

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When I said "JK owners" I wasn't referring to JKO.... KJ, people in this section respect what you have to say. Make sure you're not just repeating marketing BS with no technical grounding. Do yourself and others a favor and dig into the finer points of suspension and steering so that your advice is always correct.
Thanks !! I know you were referring to JK owners. Wayalife :eek:
Edit: crap .. I need to read. Understood :thumb:

I am not a geometry wiz, that's for sure. I agree with what you're saying, don't lead people to add Highsteer right away. Def not at 2.5" :nonono:

Besides roll center,..( And this is what I was led to believe) Flattening the angles is another benefit to a Highsteer kit. I'm taking talker lifts 3.5+

My own experience. Our roads here are pretty bad, and As you know, There's only so much caster you can run at 4" of (front) lift. The Highsteer setup cured a lot of steering harshness over uneven road. If I was driving over perfect roads and/or a lot of freeway .. The benefits would not be as noticeable. A lot of mods we do are relative based a lot of things.
 

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Do you mean the bds lift in general or just bds adjustable track bars?

Ok I will get a good drive to see the feel for it this afternoon, I'm headed back to school at carson newman near knoxville! What should I look out for to feel that the axle is not centered right?
Just the bds track bars. The bds lift with fox shocks and aev brackets has been great. Their track bars use a very stiff bushing that doesn't allow for much flex at all, pretty much every time we go out wheelin I have to re-tighten the jam nuts.
 

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You JK guys are silly.....'lifting' the Jeep won't cause bump steer. Bump steer is caused by an unparallel condition between the drag link and track bar pivot points. Assuming you install 3" springs, the track bar and drag link frame-end pivot points go up together the same amount.....still parallel. ;)
Not exactly. We "JK guys" have a 5-link suspension system coupled with a Pitman arm 2-link steering system. Changes in suspension height directly impact the suspension and steering geometry, so adding a lift kit directly impact steering characteristics such as Caster Angle, bumper-steer, roll-steer and the like.

Furthermore, the Track Bar (~32") and the Drag Link (~40") are not the same length. They are not perfectly parallel even on a stock JK but they are close so even a stock JK has some cross-coupling of the vertical and lateral degrees of freedom and hence some bump-steer. As the ride height increases via a lift kit the the Track Bar angles increases more rapidly since it is shorter and hence the difference in angle between it and the Drag Link increases. These changes in geometry happen directly as a result of the lift kit and they are directly proportional to the size of the lift kit.

No doubt we JK guys are silly because we continually empty our coffers in building our beloved Jeeps and sometimes make some poor choices but our silliness does not stem from our lack of understanding of bump-steer. :D
 

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Not exactly. We "JK guys" have a 5-link suspension system coupled with a Pitman arm 2-link steering system. Changes in suspension height directly impact the suspension and steering geometry, so adding a lift kit directly impact steering characteristics such as Caster Angle, bumper-steer, roll-steer and the like. Furthermore, the Track Bar (~32") and the Drag Link (~40") are not the same length. They are not perfectly parallel even on a stock JK but they are close so even a stock JK has some cross-coupling of the vertical and lateral degrees of freedom and hence some bump-steer. As the ride height increases via a lift kit the the Track Bar angles increases more rapidly since it is shorter and hence the difference in angle between it and the Drag Link increases. These changes in geometry happen directly as a result of the lift kit and they are directly proportional to the size of the lift kit.
Imped runs a JK 44 on his TJ.

I'm not here to argue geometry, but that makes sense. The shorter length of the TB, and how lifting changes each differently.
 
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