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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Coil Overs
  • Rebuildable
  • Re-valve able
  • Adjustable ride height
  • Coils cannot unseat
  • Proper control arms won't bind

6pak Shocks

  • Rebuildable
  • Re-valve able
  • Coils cannot unseat up to 16" travel
  • Duroflex joints won't bind and maintain the same stock ride

If am looking for that 3.5 - 4 inch lift wouldn't the 6pak provide the same benefits of the coil over pretty much? They are both rebuildable, tunable, and don't unseat coils. The only thing I would be loosing is the ability to change ride height. However, if I am happy with the 3.5 - 4 inch height they are designed for does it matter? Let's say I wanted a lift height of 6" one day. That would pretty much make the 6pak shocks worthless because they are not adjustable for ride height?

Short arm vs long arm
From what I understand the main reason for long arm is to relieve the angles, prevent binding of the joints, provide better handling, and increase ride quality. At the lift height of 3.5 to 4 inches long arms are not really needed on the JK for angles due to longer control arms than previous generations. However, at over 4 inches they are recommended. If the Duroflex joint and Metalcloak lift provides the same handling and ride quality of stock would it be worth going to long arm (custom with Duroflex joints)? The Duroflex joint also does not bind with the 6pak shocks installed, however, the longest 6pak I can confirm that does not bind is the 14" travel ones. If I go the route of 16" travel 6paks I cannot confirm they won't bind.

Flex
Wouldn't 16" of travel on the 6pak equal the same 16" travel on a coilover? For example, if Jeep 'A' was running 16" travel 6pak shocks and Jeep "B" had 14" travel coilovers wouldn't Jeep "A" have greater flex?

I am not trying to cause "drama" but rather debate the 6pak shock. I have looked at numerous forums and none really discuss coil over vs 6pak to well. Kinda a dark topic...
 

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Had the same debate in my head, went with the 6pak because they are very similar and are even a little cheaper but price didn't matter. I just don't see the need for a coilover because I am not crawling over the rubicon everyday. They both have the same amount of travel so I didn't see the advantage of a coilover. So I bought the gamechanger kit with the 6paks
 

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As Sinister said, going coilover has way more work involved and cost. There is aboslutely a benefit to coilover but not for everyone. Coilover's need to have mounts fabricated.

-Dan
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I understand coil overs require more work to function properly. However, what are these "benefits" you speak off besides adjusting the ride height?

For the same price of the 6pak shocks you can get the Synergy Suspension mounts and 16" travel Ballastic Fabrication coilovers.
 

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Coil Overs
  • Rebuildable
  • Re-valve able
  • Adjustable ride height
  • Coils cannot unseat
  • Proper control arms won't bind

6pak Shocks

  • Rebuildable
  • Re-valve able
  • Coils cannot unseat up to 16" travel
  • Duroflex joints won't bind and maintain the same stock ride

If am looking for that 3.5 - 4 inch lift wouldn't the 6pak provide the same benefits of the coil over pretty much? They are both rebuildable, tunable, and don't unseat coils. The only thing I would be loosing is the ability to change ride height. However, if I am happy with the 3.5 - 4 inch height they are designed for does it matter? Let's say I wanted a lift height of 6" one day. That would pretty much make the 6pak shocks worthless because they are not adjustable for ride height?

Short arm vs long arm
From what I understand the main reason for long arm is to relieve the angles, prevent binding of the joints, provide better handling, and increase ride quality. At the lift height of 3.5 to 4 inches long arms are not really needed on the JK for angles due to longer control arms than previous generations. However, at over 4 inches they are recommended. If the Duroflex joint and Metalcloak lift provides the same handling and ride quality of stock would it be worth going to long arm (custom with Duroflex joints)? The Duroflex joint also does not bind with the 6pak shocks installed, however, the longest 6pak I can confirm that does not bind is the 14" travel ones. If I go the route of 16" travel 6paks I cannot confirm they won't bind.

Flex
Wouldn't 16" of travel on the 6pak equal the same 16" travel on a coilover? For example, if Jeep 'A' was running 16" travel 6pak shocks and Jeep "B" had 14" travel coilovers wouldn't Jeep "A" have greater flex?

I am not trying to cause "drama" but rather debate the 6pak shock. I have looked at numerous forums and none really discuss coil over vs 6pak to well. Kinda a dark topic...
Only you can decide this. What are your plans for your rig. Coilovers and long arms are very expensive to set up right. You must set up your steering system for this also. And then you need to either have the fabrication skills to do it right, or have the cash to hire some one that does have the skills. If you are building a mall crawler, that is a hell of a lot of cash for "looks and bragging rights" The 6 pak shocks are still kind of new; probably not a lot of people running them. 6paks will probably bolt in to your stock shock mounts, and the gamechanger will probably have joints that can flex along with their system and not bind. The long arms and coilovers, if done correctly, will drive and ride like out of this world. I don't know if any of the "mid" arm systems will compete.
Don't know if any of this helped you or not. Good luck with your decision.
 

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I understand coil overs require more work to function properly. However, what are these "benefits" you speak off besides adjusting the ride height?

For the same price of the 6pak shocks you can get the Synergy Suspension mounts and 16" travel Ballastic Fabrication coilovers.
I am in pretty much the same boat as you. The difference is that coilovers offer a "true dual rate because of 2 separate shocks. But MC offers dual rate coils so I am not too sure about much else.
 

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Let me start by saying I m a fan of the gamechanger lifts. I think the idea is super cool and I love how you can call Metal cloak and talk to matson. The brain behind it all.

That being said. The gamechanger and a coilover are two different things. The game changer's primary goal is to maximize "up travel". Matson himself will tell you that you need his flares to see the maximum benefit, because they allow sooooo much up travel. This keeps your center of gravity low, while climbing stuff.

Other companies use down travel to clear obsticles, but your cabin will be in a taller position when climbing stuff.

A coilover is different. It allows for 2 different springs to be used. And in RK's position, whos coilovers I'll be installing, they are on 2.6'' shock. so you have two different springs working. This should give you a better on road ride as well as more downward stretch in the rocks.

The game changer is cool tho, and I'd love to see some pics.
 

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MC is in the process of shipping the gamechanger to me as we speak. The floating shock body seems to be very effective. And 35" tires with trimmed fenders should reap the benefits of this lift over others.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I actually wheel my Jeep off road on moderately rated trails. I am not concerned about the cost as long as I can keep everything below $5,000 not including installations. From what I have heard nothing beats the Metalcloak arms with the Duroflex joins when it comes to ride quality even though its short arm. Maybe the Metalcloak arms ride better than long arms due to the joint? Maybe a long arm system using Duroflex joints at both ends would ride even better than the short arm setup? Who knows... I have debated ordering a bolt on long arm upgrade kit from one of the bolt on companies and requesting that they don't install joints and leave both ends threaded with nothing in them (would install Duroflex joints).

My goal here is to have the best shock system for moderate speed off road and daily driving. It appears that most coil overs provide about 5" up and 9" down while the 6pak would provide 8" up and 8" down.

So I guess the remaining question is do coilovers ride better than stock (on all four corners) or about the same? So far my Metalcloak kit has provided the same ride quality with increased handling.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I am in pretty much the same boat as you. The difference is that coilovers offer a "true dual rate because of 2 separate shocks. But MC offers dual rate coils so I am not too sure about much else.
Same here. That is one of the advantages people have brought up of running coilovers. However, as you said Metalcloak offers Dual Rate coils just the same.

Let me start by saying I m a fan of the gamechanger lifts. I think the idea is super cool and I love how you can call Metal cloak and talk to matson. The brain behind it all.

That being said. The gamechanger and a coilover are two different things. The game changer's primary goal is to maximize "up travel". Matson himself will tell you that you need his flares to see the maximum benefit, because they allow sooooo much up travel. This keeps your center of gravity low, while climbing stuff.

Other companies use down travel to clear obsticles, but your cabin will be in a taller position when climbing stuff.

A coilover is different. It allows for 2 different springs to be used. Metalcloak offers a Dual Rate coil which is essentially the same thing but one coil. And in RK's position, whos coilovers I'll be installing, they are on 2.6'' shock. so you have two different springs working. I have noticed that when flexing out the Metalcloak coils the lower section of the coil expands more than the upper section. Kinda acting like two separate coils or "Dual Rates". However, I understand Metalcloak is more of a hybrid than a true "Dual Rate" found in coilovers. This should give you a better on road ride as well as more downward stretch in the rocks. Not always true, the coilover may not provide any more downward stretch in the rocks. Possibly even less pending travel. Down travel is down travel regardless of if its from coilover or 6pak. A 12" coilover would have about 8" down travel and 4" up travel while the 6pak provides the same 8" down and 8" up. On the other hand a 16" travel coilover would provide 4" up and 12" down. Again 16" is 16"

The game changer is cool tho, and I'd love to see some pics.

MC is in the process of shipping the gamechanger to me as we speak. The floating shock body seems to be very effective. And 35" tires with trimmed fenders should reap the benefits of this lift over others.
Let us know how it works out for you. I have to say that with the Game Changer Lite edition I have noticed it maintained the same factory ride quality while increasing the handling. Do coilovers generally maintain stock ride quality or increase it?
 

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I think that it will ride differently with the 6paks vs the OME. the metalcloak joints work the best with their kit so even though you can mix and match with coilovers, I think the the kit as a whole works best as a complete system with the 6paks.
 

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I think the dual rate coil may be better than progressive, but your kidding yourself if you think its superior to 2 separate springs. Mind you, you can change the springs individually to alter the ride.
 

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I know that 2 springs would be better but is it really all that necessary? This isn't a Cadillac and how much better ride quality with coilovers vs MC dual rates and 6pak? Is it worth it?
 

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I know that 2 springs would be better but is it really all that necessary? This isn't a Cadillac and how much better ride quality with coilovers vs MC dual rates and 6pak? Is it worth it?
Its hard to tell, I've never seen MC dual rates up close.

It all comes down to what you're willing to spend.
 

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Even with no budget, I am saying that I am not sure if the coilovers are worth it unless the jeep is mostly for offroad use.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I think the dual rate coil may be better than progressive, but your kidding yourself if you think its superior to 2 separate springs. Mind you, you can change the springs individually to alter the ride.
Two separate coils when chosen properly will beat the Metalcloak Dual Rate coil any day of the week. The question is how better are they? Are we talking night and day or barely noticeable?

I know that 2 springs would be better but is it really all that necessary? This isn't a Cadillac and how much better ride quality with coilovers vs MC dual rates and 6pak? Is it worth it?
Even with no budget, I am saying that I am not sure if the coilovers are worth it unless the jeep is mostly for offroad use.
 
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