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You could also measure what your preload is initially before removing the pinion nut and with the carrier and axle shafts still in..... Shouldn't be more than 60in/lbs with good bearings
 

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Discussion Starter #22
If you do want to measure proper preload with a beam type wrench and the axle shafts and carrier are still in, you're looking for around 25-30in/lbs. You don't measure preload by the initial turn but while constantly and steadily turning the pinion with the wrench.
You could also measure what your preload is initially before removing the pinion nut and with the carrier and axle shafts still in..... Shouldn't be more than 60in/lbs with good bearings
This is the info I'm looking for. I'll order the 0-80 inch pound torque wrench.

Thanks and Good Luck, L.M.
 

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Discussion Starter #24
This is the inch pound beam torque wrench i own for doing pinion preload https://www.matcotools.com/catalog/product/DR100I/DUAL-ROUND-BEAM-TORQUE-WRENCHES/
Matco is good stuff. Top quality but not as shiny and as expensive as Snap-On.
I ordered a cheap one from Amazon. It doesn't have to be accurate, just consistent in what it measures. If it's off by 10%, it doesn't matter, as long as it measures whatever the current pre-load is and the after pre-load the same. Then I'll add 5 inch pounds pre-load and call it good.

Thanks and Good Luck, L.M.
 

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You don't automatically ADD inch lbs of preload...
The manual was suggesting adding 5 ft lbs of torque to the nut which I'm against doing without being able to measure preload...

Your inch lbs rating of preload is an acceptable range...

Btw... it's not that much work to yank the carrier so you can measure tye preload correctly... if ur goung this far go ahead and do it... then you can inspect carrier bearings and wheel bearings and replace axle seals while ur at it...
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Well, I measured the pinion preload with the new torque wrench. Carrier and axles in place, brake drums off (drums were dragging slightly and causing reading to go up).
The beam style torque wrench read 2.5 inch pounds during several tries. This was with no fluid in the differential and while constantly turning the pinion nut with the torque wrench. Based on the above posts, it seems very low.

I also marked the yoke, the shaft and the nut plus I counted the number of exposed threads rather than the number of turns to remove the nut. I couldn't break the nut loose with my breaker bar so I loosened it with my impact wrench.

There were 4 exposed threads prior to loosening the nut. I'll install the nut until I have 3 threads and then check the torque. If it's not up to the 2.5 inch pounds, I'll continue to tighten it incrementally until I have 4 threads exposed or have reached the 2.5 inch pounds prior measurement. In a perfect world, I would expect the two to happen together. Then, tighten it to 7.5 inch pounds unless it goes beyond 5 threads.

Looking for input because of the low preload initial measurement.

Good Luck, L.M.
 

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Well, I measured the pinion preload with the new torque wrench. Carrier and axles in place, brake drums off (drums were dragging slightly and causing reading to go up).
The beam style torque wrench read 2.5 inch pounds during several tries. This was with no fluid in the differential and while constantly turning the pinion nut with the torque wrench. Based on the above posts, it seems very low.

I also marked the yoke, the shaft and the nut plus I counted the number of exposed threads rather than the number of turns to remove the nut. I couldn't break the nut loose with my breaker bar so I loosened it with my impact wrench.

There were 4 exposed threads prior to loosening the nut. I'll install the nut until I have 3 threads and then check the torque. If it's not up to the 2.5 inch pounds, I'll continue to tighten it incrementally until I have 4 threads exposed or have reached the 2.5 inch pounds prior measurement. In a perfect world, I would expect the two to happen together. Then, tighten it to 7.5 inch pounds unless it goes beyond 5 threads.

Looking for input because of the low preload initial measurement.

Good Luck, L.M.
Very broken in bearings most likely. I'd get it to at least 15-20in/lbs and run it.
 

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Or take the carrier out and get the main pinion preload to 5in/lbs.
 

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Discussion Starter #29
Very broken in bearings most likely. I'd get it to at least 15-20in/lbs and run it.
That's the plan. The donor Jeep had 138K miles so I'm not too surprised that the bearings could be "very broken in".

In turning the pinion/differential and the axles I didn't feel nor hear anything rough or loose. The ring gear looked as perfect as I might expect.

When I went to pull the yoke, I found I don't have the correct bolts in my puller kit, so I'll have to wait until tomorrow so I can go to Fastenall for some 1/4-28 X 2 1/2" bolts. It seems nobody locally stocks fine thread bolts.
I'm getting the greenhouse ready to plant and the Jeep is driveable so I'm not in such a great hurry that a day or two delay is a big deal for me.

I'll post again once I have the new seal in place.

Good Luck, L.M.
 

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Discussion Starter #30
Very broken in bearings most likely. I'd get it to at least 15-20in/lbs and run it.
Well, I finally found and ordered 1/4-28 X 3" bolts for my puller. I called all over and couldn't find any fine thread hardware within a reasonable driving distance. Fastenal isn't taking walk in customers during the current virus problem. Home Depot, NAPA, Carquest, Autozone didn't have any fine thread hardware. I was finally able to find a 6 pack on Amazon (I need only 2 bolts for my puller). They came yesterday and I pulled the yoke this morning. Cleaned the gasket surfaces to brand new pristine clean. Installed the new seal with a thin swipe of RTV around the outside. It went on so easy. Just a light tap, tap, tap with my favorite body hammer. The yoke slid easily in place, all nicely lined up with the marks I made. Things were going so well, UNTIL, I put a couple drops of Loctite on the pinion shaft threads and ran the old nut down. I could barely get the nut to the old mark where the torque to turn it was 2.5 ft lbs.
My plan was to tighten it to at least 15 in lbs, per c5wagner's suggestion. Standing on a 24" breaker bar, the nut wouldn't turn any farther.

I took the yoke back off and looked for any blockage or buggers. Found none. When I cleaned the surface that the seal touches, I also cleaned the pinion shaft threads with a wire brush on a die grinder. The pinion shaft threads were totally clean and undamaged.

I'm guessing the crush sleeve was overcrushed by some PO. Unless someone has a better idea, it looks like I'll have to buy a complete ring and pinion install kit, pull the carrier and replace the carrier bearings, pinion bearings crush sleeve and new seals. If I end up doing that, I'll probably just pull the 3:07 R&P out of my current axle and install the one from the 4:10 axle I've been working on. At least I'll not have to change my axle housing.

What I'm looking for is suggestions for the most practical way to get this old heap re-geared to a lower ratio.
If I end up pulling the R&P, does anyone have a suggestion for a high quality R&P bearing & seal kit?

And, this is just the rear axle. I have the front axle ready to install, but it doesn't make sense to do so until I have the rear completely done. When I get the rear done, I'll pull my front driveshaft and drive the Jeep around a bit just to insure it's all done to my satisfaction. NO noise, grumbles, growls or howls.

TIA & Good Luck, L.M.
 

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I'd just get a new crush sleeve and pinion nut and run the bearings as is. Get a minimum of 5in/lbs with the beam type wrench for preload and check the wear pattern, if it is fine just run it without worry.
 

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If the crush sleeve had been over crushed the nut would keep turning and preload would go off the charts....

I wonder if someone replaced the crush sleeve w a shim stack
 

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If the crush sleeve had been over crushed the nut would keep turning and preload would go off the charts....

I wonder if someone replaced the crush sleeve w a shim stack
Not exactly, this is why i hate crush sleeves and usually try to shim stack my own personal axles like my 8.8. You only get about 3/16" to 5/16" (depending on axle) of adjustability with a crush sleeve and then it won't "crush" anymore. The preload can also start to diminish if it is crushed too far as well since the sleeve fatigues and starts getting too easy to turn until you hit the point of no return. That's why i found the earlier post suggesting impact guns to tighten so "enlightened."
 

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You're a braver man than me, I farmed out my re-gear since I only had the front to be done and wasn't ready to take a chance on the learning curve trying to do it myself. My only suggestion would be to get the master install kit rather than piece out the bearings seals and gaskets just to lesson the chance of parts getting mispicked ny the vendors
 

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Save yourself all of this aggravation and buy a dana 35 out of a 4cyl yj with 4.10 gears. They can be found for less than $150.00.
 

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Save yourself all of this aggravation and buy a dana 35 out of a 4cyl yj with 4.10 gears. They can be found for less than $150.00.
That was what happened originally and all he wanted to do was replace the pinion seal on the 4.10 axle.
 

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Personally, I'd probably put it in and run it....

A little loose isn't a death sentence
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Thanks everyone for the advice.
I had planned to buy a crush sleeve, pinion nut and seal. My plan was to replace the crush sleeve without pulling the carrier. When I tried to pull the front bearing out to get to the crush sleeve, the bearing wouldn't move.
So then, I took the axles and carrier out and went to push the pinion out. It wouldn't move. The front pinion bearing was stuck on the shaft with something like Permatex. I had to use a 4# hammer and a block of wood to tap the pinion out.
When I looked at the crush sleeve, I expected to see it crushed flat. It wasn't crushed at all. I remember reading about some guy that couldn't crush a new sleeve. He bought a different brand and then was able to get his preload set. I think that's what happened to this axle. The PO or his mechanic couldn't crush the sleeve, so they tightened the nut as tight as they could and called it good.

I looked closely at the bearings and races. I'm satisfied with how they look. I found a little piece of plastic in the bottom of the case, so I'm certain that some Bubba was in there before me. The pics are the little piece of plastic. At least it wasn't the remnants of one of Bubba's sockets.

Now, I get to wait for the sleeve, seal & nut. Tomorrow, I'll clean everything up and install the inner axle seals. I'll use the non "C-"clip axles and the '87 brakes.

Good Luck, L.M.
 

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Something sounds very wrong, the bearing being stuck might explain why it wasn't crushing the crush sleeve. Was the pinion nut washer still between the pinion nut and yoke? Are you positive it was a crush sleeve and not a solid spacer? The only times I've had crush sleeves be a bear is on 14 bolts, one time I had to start crushing it in a 20 ton shop press just to get it to start crushing...
 

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Discussion Starter #40
I'm not a mechanic. For the first half of my career I was a bodyman. Then I was a body shop owner. Naturally I've done a lot of mechanical work as part of my job and recreationally. However, this is the first time I've been inside the guts of an axle.

From the diagrams and exploded views I've seen, there is no washer between the nut and the yoke. The nut is flanged.
The crush sleeve looks like the pics I see when I go to order one. I ordered a sleeve, nut and seal. They won't be here until some time next week. Then I'll compare the old one and the new one. I ordered a Spicer kit, in hopes it'll be OE quality.

I was tempted to let it go because the leaking seal was more like some seepage rather than a drip or drops. Since it's my goal to have a leak free Jeep I decided to go ahead and fix it before installing the axle assembly. I'm glad I did. Now, I'm comfortable that the carrier & pinion bearings are all good, I'll have new wheel bearings & seals and (once I'm done) that the preload is set properly and that the R&P mesh is good. Oh, yeah, and I'll have a new pinion seal.

Good Luck, L.M.
 
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