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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
So, after five months and two weeks of owning a Toyota Tacoma, I decided I had enough.

I am thinking to order a JLU Sahara in Sarge Green when it becomes available later this year.

I am looking at:

  • Sarge Green
  • Dark Saddle interior
  • V6
  • Manual transmission
  • Color matched hardtop
  • Leather seats
  • Cold weather group
  • LED group
  • 8.4 screen nav + Premium audio group

Questions:

  1. Any known issues with JLs? I’ve read about the wandering steering, the frame welds, and the dimply doors.
    • Have they fixed the wandering steering problem?
    • Are ball joints still an issue with JL? How are the new axles holding?
    • Anything else that is emerging as an issue?
  2. What is the going price for these vehicles these days, particularly for factory orders? Prices seem to be all over the place. I even see several leftover 2018s still on dealer lots going for anywhere from full MSRP to $10,000 OFF. My local Jeep dealer is simply atrocious, so I will likely order from the dealer where I got my Fiat Spider, 125 miles away.
  3. Any options that I’m leaving out that is a must-have? I’m trying to strike a balance between getting enough comfort and convenience features, without overloading the Jeep with stuff that will be prone to break down and give me issues.
Thanks in advance.

Aldo
 

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I also just got into a Wrangler and coming from a BMW X5 5.0, I know a crazy switch over, long story. I went 2019 only because I stumbled into a great deal on a Rubicon that was almost my ideal build. Had a couple things I probably wouldn't have ordered but so be it. Sticker was just south of $55 (almost loaded) and I was out the door at $49.5.

I have noticed the steering wander but coming from an X5 with sport tires is a tough comparison. I think you've hit the nail on the head with your options.

All the best on your search!
 

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I'm 3 weeks into my order and will be trading in my 2-door JK Rubi for a 4-door Rubi in Ocean Blue. If they had Tank again I'd re-order that in a heartbeat.

One thing you may want to consider is the Trailer Tow and HD Electric group as it gives you the aux switches so you don't have to add an SPOD later on.

I also added the safety group for blind spot monitoring; I rent a ton of cars while traveling and have gotten so used to this feature that I miss it when I get back into my existing Jeep.

I ordered with cloth seats and adding a customer leather after the fact at the dealer for about the same price as factory leather, which gives you more options.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
I'm 3 weeks into my order and will be trading in my 2-door JK Rubi for a 4-door Rubi in Ocean Blue. If they had Tank again I'd re-order that in a heartbeat.

One thing you may want to consider is the Trailer Tow and HD Electric group as it gives you the aux switches so you don't have to add an SPOD later on.

I also added the safety group for blind spot monitoring; I rent a ton of cars while traveling and have gotten so used to this feature that I miss it when I get back into my existing Jeep.

I ordered with cloth seats and adding a customer leather after the fact at the dealer for about the same price as factory leather, which gives you more options.
Awesome! Yeah the aux switches is a good idea.

Care to elaborate on the custom leather options? Is this something you arrange through the dealer or on your own?
 

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@aldo90731 do tell? grass not greener in a Yota? remember it is a fca vehicle there will always be issues. JK's were out 12 years and still had issues. JT just released and have issues. FCA promises you one thing frequent claims abound
 
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Awesome! Yeah the aux switches is a good idea.

Care to elaborate on the custom leather options? Is this something you arrange through the dealer or on your own?
My dealer works with a couple of different leather vendors and one is called ALEA Leather. You can go on line and design your own and get some ideas (The JL is on their Website).

I’ll be rolling the cost into the vehicle, the first one that is kind of classic sedate is $1300 so less than the Jeep leather option; it’s in a Mojito on their floor hence the green stitching. You can also add any custom stitching in the head rest that you want I.e. Sahara or anything.

Here are a couple of examples in the pics:
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
@aldo90731 do tell? grass not greener in a Yota? remember it is a fca vehicle there will always be issues. JK's were out 12 years and still had issues. JT just released and have issues. FCA promises you one thing frequent claims abound
Yup. I had to give Toyota a try, especially given the atrocious Jeep dealer we have here.

The Toyota dealer is indeed a LOT better. And the Tacoma truck feels well put together. But that’s about it.

The truck has these mysterious vibrations/shudders between 10 and 45 MPH, either decelerating or accelerating. It also produces this low frequency vibration that cycles on-and-off every 15 seconds or so whenever I set the cruise control on the freeway. TRD Off Road comes with this Crawl Control that is supposed to aid traction with the aid of electronics. But the thing creates more drama than it solves with really obnoxious noises and other things Jeep would handle a lot more seamlessly.

But my biggest issues are (1) the automatic transmission and (2) the seating position. It appears Toyota tried to extract as much MPG out of a 20-year old truck by giving it extremely high gearing and calibrating the transmission to upshift as soon as possible. The result is an automatic transmission that refuses to do anything when you need it to, or to constantly hunt for gears when it doesn’t need to.

After six months I still haven’t found a comfortable position. The seat is flat and unsupportive, and you sit low to the floor with your legs and arms stretched out to the front. I tried stuffing some washers under the seat rails to try to give it more support but it helped little.

Toyota considers everyone of these issues to be “normal.” So there’s little hope of getting them rectified.

Apparently the automatic transmission issue can be greatly reduced with a $700 aftermarket programmer, but then you risk voiding the warranty.

I’ve put 3,500 miles on the Tacoma in six months. That tells you how little I enjoy driving it.

So here I am... I am hoping that legendary Tacoma resale value comes through when I’m ready to get rid of it.
 

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YEA Aldo is back. Yup Wranglers aren't perfect but they sure are fun. If you don't mind, please tell us what you didn't like about the Taco. As for the Sahara, I'd want steel bumpers, LED's, tow pkg, best sound system, and painted fender protection of some sort.
 

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Yup. I had to give Toyota a try, especially given the atrocious Jeep dealer we have here.

The Toyota dealer is indeed a LOT better. And the Tacoma truck feels well put together. But that’s about it.

The truck has these mysterious vibrations/shudders between 10 and 45 MPH, either decelerating or accelerating. It also produces this low frequency vibration that cycles on-and-off every 15 seconds or so whenever I set the cruise control on the freeway. TRD Off Road comes with this Crawl Control that is supposed to aid traction with the aid of electronics. But the thing creates more drama than it solves with really obnoxious noises and other things Jeep would handle a lot more seamlessly.

But my biggest issues are (1) the automatic transmission and (2) the seating position. It appears Toyota tried to extract as much MPG out of a 20-year old truck by giving it extremely high gearing and calibrating the transmission to upshift as soon as possible. The result is an automatic transmission that refuses to do anything when you need it to, or to constantly hunt for gears when it doesn’t need to.

After six months I still haven’t found a comfortable position. The seat is flat and unsupportive, and you sit low to the floor with your legs and arms stretched out to the front. I tried stuffing some washers under the seat rails to try to give it more support but it helped little.

Toyota considers everyone of these issues to be “normal.” So there’s little hope of getting them rectified.

Apparently the automatic transmission issue can be greatly reduced with a $700 aftermarket programmer, but then you risk voiding the warranty.

I’ve put 3,500 miles on the Tacoma in six months. That tells you how little I enjoy driving it.

So here I am... I am hoping that legendary Tacoma resale value comes through when I’m ready to get rid of it.
I understand. I sat in a TRD pro a while back and I am not a big guy and I did not fit.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
So what’s the largest tire size you can fit on a Sahara JL without lifting or rubbing?

255/80-17?
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
YEA Aldo is back. Yup Wranglers aren't perfect but they sure are fun. If you don't mind, please tell us what you didn't like about the Taco. As for the Sahara, I'd want steel bumpers, LED's, tow pkg, best sound system, and painted fender protection of some sort.
:D

Yes I’d love to get the steel bumpers, but I don’t think I can order them on a Sahara. I can always add them later.

See post No 7 above for my Tacoma issues.
 

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So what’s the largest tire size you can fit on a Sahara JL without lifting or rubbing?

255/80-17?
285/70/17 on a Sport, so I assume the same except on 18 inch rims on a Sahara. The 3.45 gears respond like the 3.73 did on JKs meaning 33's are great on the JL. Though I have the 8speed so the 6 might be a little different.

After a little over 6 months my JL has no issues in any way. Steering is identical to my JK. Build quality is great. I have no complaints at all related to how the vehicle performs and quality. I'm not exactly picky, but there really isn't anything to make me doubt my Jeep. My JL is exactly what I wanted it to be, an improved and more modern JK.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
285/70/17 on a Sport, so I assume the same except on 18 inch rims on a Sahara. The 3.45 gears respond like the 3.73 did on JKs meaning 33's are great on the JL. Though I have the 8speed so the 6 might be a little different.

After a little over 6 months my JL has no issues in any way. Steering is identical to my JK. Build quality is great. I have no complaints at all related to how the vehicle performs and quality. I'm not exactly picky, but there really isn't anything to make me doubt my Jeep. My JL is exactly what I wanted it to be, an improved and more modern JK.
That’s great to hear!

I find I’ve gotten pickier with age. LOL! I just need to learn to pick which battles are worth fighting...

I test drove a JL Sport a couple weeks ago: I didn’t feel the wandering steering I noticed when I test drove those two JLs a year ago.
 

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I ordered a 2020 Rubicon 4D via Dennis Dillon Jeep in Caldwell, ID. They offered me a significant discount over my local dealers. Enough to easily pay for a one way airfare to go get the Jeep, drive it back, and much more. I got that hint here on the forum. Mine is being built right now.
 

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Welcome back to the dark side Aldo! Never realized it would be quite so soon!

Gone from the initial release is the complaining about all the things that are wrong with it. No recent recalls that I have heard of. Even the turbo folks are not complaining. Lot's of happy Jeepers that I can see.

I would call a few folks out this way and see what they will do to help you out for pricing. Dennis Dillon and Dave Smith are pretty aggressive out in these parts. Also, try Costco auto program and see if they jump straight to the bottom line.

How is the other convertible?
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Welcome back to the dark side Aldo! Never realized it would be quite so soon!

Gone from the initial release is the complaining about all the things that are wrong with it. No recent recalls that I have heard of. Even the turbo folks are not complaining. Lot's of happy Jeepers that I can see.

I would call a few folks out this way and see what they will do to help you out for pricing. Dennis Dillon and Dave Smith are pretty aggressive out in these parts. Also, try Costco auto program and see if they jump straight to the bottom line.

How is the other convertible?
Thanks! It’ll probably be one year by the time I order it. I’m eyeing spring 2020 delivery.

That's good to hear. Dennis Dillon is relatively close to me. Definitely a drive I can do in a day and a half.

The Fiat had the water pump replaced, twice, under warranty. The car has almost 6,000 miles. Despite the smiles I was driving without coolant on that photo. The local mountain roads are the perfect habitat for it. The car is a joy to drive. :D

 

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Discussion Starter #17
Here she is getting towed to the dealership for its second water pump in 300 miles. Thankfully Fiats come with a 4-year/48,000 mile warranty.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
Yup. Like @jadmt and @AzHyper say: Jeeps have issues.

In fact, as the photo above shows, owning an FCA product involves having AAA on speed dial and being in good terms with your mechanic.

But like I said, I have to pick my battles.
 

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Thanks! It’ll probably be one year by the time I order it. I’m eyeing spring 2020 delivery.

That's good to hear. Dennis Dillon is relatively close to me. Definitely a drive I can do in a day and a half.

The Fiat had the water pump replaced, twice, under warranty. The car has almost 6,000 miles. Despite the smiles I was driving without coolant on that photo. The local mountain roads are the perfect habitat for it. The car is a joy to drive. :D

Sharp car - is that a Spyder?
 
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