worth it?

1434 Views 17 Replies 11 Participants Last post by KittyPrawn, Oct 22, 2012

pat_smith1969

Discussion Starter · Oct 22, 2012

I have read several threads regarding the Rubi vs the other models. The consensus is that if you don't know you need a Rubi.. then you don't. I wanted a Sport S, was going to add a 430n after the fact from Ebay, was going to add 33" tires and a 2" lift.. and a few other small things.

This causes the price to rise to the same as the rubi and sahara (give or take 1k).

I like the Rubi wheels and tires and if I got a Rubi i would keep them until the tires wore out THEN think of something bigger (and lift). I found a Rubi that has EVERYTHING I want on it, and in the color I want (rare Billet).

I figure the the re-sale/trade value on a Rubi would be greater than a Sport S with a ton of mods... not sure though.

Also this particular one has a 4.10 rear. Will this make it unsuitable for a daily driver (mixed highway and city)... with occasional off roading... and not real extreme off roading at that. Will the 4.10 kill the gas mileage drastically? (yes I know no one choses a wrangler for it's mileage).

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MTH

· #2 · Oct 22, 2012 (Edited)

Just pause for a moment and take a deep breath.

Now . . . do you really think a major vehicle manufacturer would sell a vehicle that's unsuitable for being a daily driver?

Countless clueless folks--who will never go offroad a day in their life and have no idea what the difference is between 4H and 4L--buy Rubis because they're the "top of the line." Wouldn't you expect Chrysler knows this? And if they do, don't you think they'd have an interest in making sure all of these people don't get on the highway and realize the vehicle can't handle it?

Of course Rubis are fine daily drivers. I see them on the highway all the time. So there you have it.

As to resale, yes, Rubis generally have higher resale values and faster resale times. However, you pay more for them to begin with, so this benefit isn't "free." Whether a given stock Rubi will have a higher resale value than a modded Sport . . . who knows? Maybe. Depends on the relative conditions, the mods added, and the particular folks in the market at that moment. Whatever the case, that's a pretty speculative basis upon which to buy a vehicle.

As to mpgs, yes, a stock 4.10 Rubi will generally get fewer mpgs than a stock 3.73 or 3.21 Sport. But realistically, this is going to be a marginal difference--probably about 1 to 2 mpgs difference on average depending on driving style. And in any event, if you're going to be putting bigger tires on the Sport, then all bets are off as to mpgs. For example, I'd expect a 4.10 Rubi with 35s would get better mpgs than a 3.21 Sport with those same 35s, as the the Sport will be undergeared and will have to work a lot harder to turn the tires.

Finally, I think if you're considering modding a Sport right now, it's unrealistic to tell yourself you won't be thinking about the same mods for the Rubi. You've got to be honest with yourself.

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pat_smith1969

Discussion Starter · #3 · Oct 22, 2012

Thank you for your reply. It was helpful.

I am breathing heavy because I just ran up a flight of stairs... how did you know?:rofl:

MTH said:
Just pause for a moment and take a deep breath.

Now . . . do you really think a major vehicle manufacturer would sell a vehicle that's unsuitable for being a daily driver?
.

I can see a major manufacturer making a purpose built truck, that excells at one particular thing. The wranglers are made for off road, add that to the fact it has 4.10 gears and stock wheels. And I can see maybe it not doing well at say 85 or 90 mph - maybe - I don't know. Unsuitable is a bit harsh I suppose but I just don't want to be huffing and puffing at high speeds (despite the fact it could do those speeds pulling a mid-sized boat). I have seen many F250s out there that are for a specific purpose and I would't want them as a DD.

MTH said:
Finally, I think if you're considering modding a Sport right now, it's unrealistic to tell yourself you won't be thinking about the same mods for the Rubi. You've got to be honest with yourself.

I am embarassed to admit that it is mostly about looks. The stock sport wheels look like CRAP, add to that the mundane looking tires and it screams "upgrade me". The 2013 Rubi wheels look pretty cool (in my opinion) and the tires look a bit more "jeep like". True I would like them a bit bigger but I think that I could live with the stockers for three or so years (when the tires wear out).. THEN do a small upgrade in tires and lift - keep stock wheels. I could not suffer for three years with the sport tire/wheel package.

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hbgirl

· #4 · Oct 22, 2012 (Edited)

pat_smith1969 said:
I am embarassed to admit that it is mostly about looks. The stock sport wheels look like CRAP, add to that the mundane looking tires and it screams "upgrade me". The 2013 Rubi wheels look pretty cool (in my opinion) and the tires look a bit more "jeep like". True I would like them a bit bigger but I think that I could live with the stockers for three or so years (when the tires wear out).. THEN do a small upgrade in tires and lift - keep stock wheels. I could not suffer for three years with the sport tire/wheel package.

Honestly, take the money you save from not buying the Rubi, put it into the few mods you mentioned on a 3.73 Sport, and you'll be just as happy.

Spend any more time on this forum than you already have (it'll only take 2.3 seconds), and you'll be making changes to the Rubi as well, I promise. :whistling:

Lucy Brown

· #5 · Oct 22, 2012

pat_smith1969 said:
Thank you for your reply. It was helpful.

I am breathing heavy because I just ran up a flight of stairs... how did you know?:rofl:

I can see a major manufacturer making a purpose built truck, that excells at one particular thing. The wranglers are made for off road, add that to the fact it has 4.10 gears and stock wheels. And I can see maybe it not doing well at say 85 or 90 mph - maybe - I don't know. Unsuitable is a bit harsh I suppose but I just don't want to be huffing and puffing at high speeds (despite the fact it could do those speeds pulling a mid-sized boat). I have seen many F250s out there that are for a specific purpose and I would't want them as a DD.

I am embarassed to admit that it is mostly about looks. The stock sport wheels look like CRAP, add to that the mundane looking tires and it screams "upgrade me". The 2013 Rubi wheels look pretty cool (in my opinion) and the tires look a bit more "jeep like". True I would like them a bit bigger but I think that I could live with the stockers for three or so years (when the tires wear out).. THEN do a small upgrade in tires and lift - keep stock wheels. I could not suffer for three years with the sport tire/wheel package.

Dont be embarassed and get what you want. If you have the money go for it. You dont need a fancy watch to tell time yet people pay thousands of dollars for something that they can accomplish be just looking at their cell phone or a 20 dollar watch. A just paid almost 50 bucks for a pair of Levis jeans. My friend went to Walmart and got a pair of Wrangler jeans on sale for 15 bucks. Standing next to each other I couldnt tell the difference between the jeans but the Levis jeans make me happy so I glad to pay the extra coin. If it's worth it to you do it. The Rubicon is an awesome looking Jeep in it's stock form and is much more attractive than the other models in my opinion. If you are not going to be totally happy after paying nearly 30k for your new Jeep think twice about that purchase. Go for the Rubicon I seriously doubt you will regret it.

MTH

· #6 · Oct 22, 2012

pat_smith1969 said:
I can see a major manufacturer making a purpose built truck, that excells at one particular thing. The wranglers are made for off road, add that to the fact it has 4.10 gears and stock wheels. And I can see maybe it not doing well at say 85 or 90 mph - maybe - I don't know. Unsuitable is a bit harsh I suppose but I just don't want to be huffing and puffing at high speeds (despite the fact it could do those speeds pulling a mid-sized boat). I have seen many F250s out there that are for a specific purpose and I would't want them as a DD.

Fair enough, but this isn't a wrangler. They're appeal is too broad. It's not like you're buying a diesel pickup or some such thing that is likely to only be seen on construction sites.

That said, I think you need to let go of 85 or 90 mph in wranglers generally. Long term, that'll kill your mpgs as wranglers are wildly unaerodynamic. They're handling isn't that hot at high speeds either. On the highway, I'd expect to generally keep it south of 80. Preferably closer to 70.

Get in there and test drive a few to see.

pat_smith1969 said:
I am embarassed to admit that it is mostly about looks. The stock sport wheels look like CRAP, add to that the mundane looking tires and it screams "upgrade me". The 2013 Rubi wheels look pretty cool (in my opinion) and the tires look a bit more "jeep like". True I would like them a bit bigger but I think that I could live with the stockers for three or so years (when the tires wear out).. THEN do a small upgrade in tires and lift - keep stock wheels. I could not suffer for three years with the sport tire/wheel package.

Check Craigslist. Because so many folks lift jeeps and put on new wheels/tires, you can often find complete stock set ups with just a few miles on them for $500 to $1k.

MTH

· #7 · Oct 22, 2012 (Edited)

Lucy Brown said:
The Rubicon is an awesome looking Jeep in it's stock form and is much more attractive than the other models in my opinion.

Agree wholeheartedly on the get what you want sentiment.

I only note that a stock rubi looks identical to a stock sport except for the tires/wheels, the rock rails, and the decals.

The tires/wheels and rails appear routinely on Craigslist and can usually be had for less than $1k total. You can also get custom decals for the hood that say anything you like for around $20.

So good looks, IMO, just isn't a viable reason to buy a rubi. It's of course the OP's money to spend as he likes, but he came here asking for advice so I assume he wants our input on what we think makes a "good" purchase.

Blkfenderslookbetter

· #8 · Oct 22, 2012

I went through the same thought process before buying my Sport. The ONLY upgrade avaliable on the Rubi, that was not available on the Sport that I really considered was the NAV system. And after some thought (and some price checks) I decided that I could get by with my IPhone map app. My last 2 vehicles had the built-in NAV systems, and while they were nice to haves, they really weren't a NEED to have. Especially when you can have the app for free. I haven't modded my wheels/tires/lift yet but it is definitely on the short list of things to do. I agree that the tires are pretty mundane on a Sport, but IMHO they're better than having the Rubi tires for DD. I'm going with AT tires when I do mod the wheels soon.

I'm certainly in the "Buy what you want" catagory, but you WILL be modding. That's a certainty. Will you be Rock crawling? For me it came down to how I was going to use my Jeep. I'm not doing any heavy duty rock crawling or extreme off roading. Sport it is for me. And I'm about $5K less out of pocket for the Rubi. Which will go a looooong way to mod my Sport.

My $.02

BTW - I liked the Rubi rails better than the tube steps on the Sport / Sahara, so I had my dealer install those at delivery too. No Rubi stickers, but .... <$$

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yomondo

· #9 · Oct 22, 2012

The Rubicon is perfectly fine as a daily driver, speaking from personal experience. Mine has been my daily driver for 3-1/2 years, even after many mods.

But if you're only planning on taking it offroad occasionally and nothing too extreme, then you don't need a Rubicon. The sport will serve you just fine, maybe just with more offroad capable tires, but even with the stock street tires they're very capable offroad.

So to answer your initial question, IMHO I don't think it would be worth it for you to buy a Rubicon based on how you plan to use it. Be warned though that hanging around Jeep forums and going on some trail runs with other Jeepers can drastically change how often and extreme you want to take your Jeep offroad (again, from personal experience).

pat_smith1969

Discussion Starter · #10 · Oct 22, 2012

Thanks guys...
yes i do want your input so keep it coming. This thread is useful to let me talk out the buying process.

I guess it all boils down to
1. the color. The ONLY Billet jeep I have found anywhere near me thus far is this Rubi with everything I want on it.
2. the nav system. I do car stereos and am very familiar with installing them myself, I just thought it would be nice to use an OEM nav system this time. A sport does not have the 430n available so I would need to buy one on ebay and install it. i am told they are plug and play this way so that is good.. the rubicon has it already installed from factory.

3. If I go with a sport (which is what I think I really want) I will need to order one from factory to get the color I want... I have no idea how that works with a trade in. I assume they will not allow me to order one without "making the deal final"... so I would need to trade in my car. So if it takes 6 weeks to get my new jeep... what do I drive for 6 weeks?
price wise the modified sport is pretty much the same as the stock rubi.

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hbgirl

· #11 · Oct 22, 2012 (Edited)

pat_smith1969 said:
3. If I go with a sport (which is what I think I really want) I will need to order one from factory to get the color I want... I have no idea how that works with a trade in. I assume they will not allow me to order one without "making the deal final"... so I would need to trade in my car. So if it takes 6 weeks to get my new jeep... what do I drive for 6 weeks? price wise the modified sport is pretty much the same as the stock rubi.

I ordered my 2013 JKU, and traded in my 2012 2-door. Ordering is just like if you walked into a stealership and they had the exact Jeep you wanted on the lot, it just takes 6-8 weeks first. Nothing is finalized until your Jeep is in and on their lot, and you inspect it and either agree to purchase or walk. Trade-in doesn't happen until that time as well. They will ask for a $500 deposit when you order; if at the time of delivery you decide you don't want it, you are free to walk, but they might try to keep the deposit. (As others state below, don't let them, and if you do give them one, make sure to remind them of it when looking over the final invoice; my salesman "forgot" to subtract it AND my incentive from the final price at first ...)

Also, I got a $500 incentive by ordering a brochure from this link:

JK Unlimited: https://www.jeep.com/vehicle_brochu...rect=true&family=wrangler_unlimited&year=2012

JK: https://www.jeep.com/vehicle_brochure/form.html?disable_ssl_redirect=true&family=wrangler&year=2012

Yes, it worked for 2013's. I didn't order the brochure until *after* I placed my JKU order, but still got the letter in time before I took delivery.

Edited to add:

There's also the Chrysler Affiliate Rewards program for automatic 1% under MSRP (if your employer participates), as well as joining Tread Lightly MTH mentions below. Take a look at the first post of the 2013 Wrangler Information Thread, at least, for tons of helpful info:

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/2013-wrangler-information-thread-161113.html

Good luck!

MTH

· #12 · Oct 22, 2012 (Edited)

You should join TreadLightly if you're buying a new jeep--1% under invoice (not MSRP) with no haggling. You can get even more off if you haggle on top of the TreadLightly discount.

Usually, the dealer appraises your trade and comes to a set number at the time you place the order. They reserve the right to refuse to honor that price if you put on an unreasonable amount of mileage or damage between when you order and when you actually trade it in.

Edit: Deposits are typical, but you can usually negotiate to get it in writing that it will be refundable even if you don't take the jeep. Unless you're ordering a very strange color or custom work, this is generally accepted by dealers--wranglers are easy to sell. If you don't take it, someone will.

j0nx

· #13 · Oct 22, 2012

Allowing them to keep your deposit if you don't buy is madness. They can't do that. They will sell the vehicle within 60 days anyway and they know that.

Lbear

· #14 · Oct 22, 2012

There is a lot of discussion in these Wrangler threads about how something looks as opposed to how it works. There's nothing wrong with that as long it isn't your first priority. So some people talk about getting this tire or that one because they "look cool on my Jeep," ignoring the performance characteristics/faults of the tire and intended use. They choose a ferocious-looking mudder and then wonder why they slip and slide on ice and packed snow in their cold northern climate in daily driving, their mileage drops and their speedo is wrong. (Don't start the hate- most on this site are very knowledgeable and don't do this).

The point here is that your first priority should be intended use/needs. Then how do you achieve that in the most economic fashion (not waste money)? If it's a daily driver with little or no offroading, look at lower cost models. Other than badging and wheels/tires the Rubi is outwardly the same looking as other Wranglers. A Wrangler Sport or Sahara can be made to look "tough" with wheels and tire mods.

I bought a Rubicon because I intend to do more offroading, don't want to do much modifying/worrying about engineering/design issues, want the safety margin and resale edge. But different strokes for different folks. If you have the money to burn to support the "feel good" thing, no harm no foul. My point again though is start with your needs, not appearance.

As to ordering, until the car arrives the deal is not final. They can up the price due to price increases from the factory and you can walk with your deposit (check the dealer paperwork- it should say all that. If it doesn't then ask for it that way).

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mtngoat

· #15 · Oct 22, 2012

You don't need to trade in to place an order, but DON'T trade you car in! Sell it in the paper or online. I got $2500 more than the dealer offer and that right there will solve some of your problems. Then you also don't have to figure out the dealer games with value on car v trade in as they try to spin your head in the finance office.
If you have good fortune with a dealer, they will probably give you a loaner to cover between when you sell you car and when your ordered Jeep arrives (at least for a week or so), mine did.
That said, go for the Rubi! Billet Rubi with no waiting...so nice! The ordering process is fun to make all sorts of new friends in the Wrangler Forum Waiting Rooms, but its SO much nicer to be driving your new Jeep!!

panthermark

· #16 · Oct 22, 2012

:whistling:Sahara in Billet? :hide:

Just kidding....

Sport S with 3.73's on different wheels is a nice vehicle and good buy if you don't need all of the features of a Rubi.

Also, I ordered my new Wrangler and we agreed on a trade-in price....but I won't trade it in until my Jeep arrives.

Lbear

· #17 · Oct 22, 2012

Don't agree about them keeping the deposit. My dealership refunds it (in fact let me set the amount) so don't get caught. It's a two way option- they can alter price and you can walk).

KittyPrawn

· #18 · Oct 22, 2012 (Edited)

MTH said:
Agree wholeheartedly on the get what you want sentiment.

I only note that a stock rubi looks identical to a stock sport except for the tires/wheels, the rock rails, and the decals.

The difference is more on the interior. The sport can't get all of the comfort features that a Rubi can. So, if you're not looking to have the luxury things, the Sport is the better purchase, or if you don't mind adding a lot of the stuff aftermarket.

I bought a Rubicon because I didn't want painted fenders, but I couldn't get the options I wanted in a Sport.

Lbear said:
The point here is that your first priority should be intended use/needs. Then how do you achieve that in the most economic fashion (not waste money)? If it's a daily driver with little or no offroading, look at lower cost models. Other than badging and wheels/tires the Rubi is outwardly the same looking as other Wranglers. A Wrangler Sport or Sahara can be made to look "tough" with wheels and tire mods.

I don't think there is anything wrong with prioritizing looks over "intended use/need." People don't need to drive 125+ mph, and yet people still drive sports cars. Because they like the look and the capability to drive 125+ mph. There is nothing wrong with that. Just because it's not how you would like to spend your money doesn't mean it's wrong for someone else.

pat_smith1969 said:
3. If I go with a sport (which is what I think I really want) I will need to order one from factory to get the color I want... I have no idea how that works with a trade in. I assume they will not allow me to order one without "making the deal final"... so I would need to trade in my car. So if it takes 6 weeks to get my new jeep... what do I drive for 6 weeks?
price wise the modified sport is pretty much the same as the stock rubi.

We talked trade in cost for my Pontiac. They gave me a number they were willing to give me. And they basically told me as long as I didn't wreck it or put $10k miles on it, they would honor that price. The fear is then in whether you trust driving it for 6 weeks. All I had to give them was a $500 deposit, and the price was final... but they didn't get the rest of my downpayment, my trade, or my financing until the Jeep was in and I could inspect it.

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