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Discussion starter · #21 ·
Spent about 4 hours today fixing my fuel vapor leak. The whole job really wasn’t that bad. Dropping the tank was much easier than I expected (hardest part was finding a tube long enough in my garage to siphon the gas out). I just propped a floor jack under it and slowly lowered it away. The first thing I did was a quick inspection for cracks and other issues. Only issues were pretty much all the gaskets were rotted (expected this) and I had two supply lines for some reason (turns out a PO replaced it but never removed the factory hose). I also found that the drivers side rollover valve wasn’t even connected to the tube (probably the source of the smell). I then pulled the fuel pump to see if my tank had the warped plastic baffle that is known to interfere with the fuel gauge float. A PO had already removed this and replaced the fuel pump at some point, so my fuel gauge issue must be a bad gauge or a bad ground (I’ll tackle this some other time). After that I got to work swapping out what seemed like most of the fuel system.

I replaced all of the gaskets, both rollover valves, all of the soft lines coming from the tank (didn’t really need it but I already had the tubing on hand), the fuel filter (including the two short rubber lines attached to it), the fuel filler/vent necks and all of the hose clamps. Probably overkill, but I didn’t want to have to do this job more than once.

My tank skid plate is pretty rusty, but I haven’t decided if I am going to go with a fuel cell or some other route for phase two so I didn’t want to drop $200 on a replacement. The previous owner took the YJ to Jeep Beach a few weeks before I bought it, so I also removed about 20 pounds of Daytona Beach from the undercarriage while I was down there.

I cycled the ignition on and off a few times to let the fuel pump prime the system, and she fired up with no issues. While I was sitting there admiring my work, I went to adjust the rear view mirror that I glued on a couple days ago, and it immediately fell off again! :banghead: Does anyone know the trick to getting the mirror to stay on?!?!?!
 

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Suspension work is done. The 5” boomerang shackles brought my caster back into spec (measured ~7 degrees). I also installed a factory sway bar (got it cheap from someone who was adding antirock). I scored a set of JKS disconnects for less than half of retail cost (guy bought the wrong part thinking it was for a JK). I’ll admit, I’m glad I did not pay full retail for these. The install was extremely easy up until I tried to connect the upper and lower halves with the pins. The passenger’s side took 20 minutes and required the use of a mallet. The driver’s side took me over 45 minutes and the only way I could get the pin to go in was to bust out the air hammer. The instructions say that the pins will get easier to install after the Jeep is driven a bit. Hopefully that is the case, but right now I’m not too confident that I’ll be able to disconnect the sway bar links when I go off-roading.

That said, the Jeep handles 100x better now. The steering is spot on, no wander and returns to center as you would expect. Turning is much more predictable and the body roll is significantly less. I’m extremely happy with the ride now, and it is much safer which makes me more comfortable putting kids and family in it.

I’m looking forward to having the Jeep back on the road. I still need to tackle the fuel smell and some miscellaneous electrical issues, but I’m still planning on taking it out to the beach next weekend. Can’t wait!
Glad your steering woes are fixed!

Just a heads up, the front shackles are actually installed upside down. While in the back, the booms are installed to clear the crossmember. However, in the front, flipping them around prevents shackle inversion as the center bar keeps them from "flipping" the other way under compression post a full drop.

https://www.quadratec.com/Assets/Installation/153348.pdf
 
Discussion starter · #23 ·
Glad your steering woes are fixed!

Just a heads up, the front shackles are actually installed upside down. While in the back, the booms are installed to clear the crossmember. However, in the front, flipping them around prevents shackle inversion as the center bar keeps them from "flipping" the other way under compression post a full drop.

https://www.quadratec.com/Assets/Installation/153348.pdf
Thanks, I was questioning if this was the right way, but I tried the other way around and the center bar on the shackle was rubbing the metal mount in the frame. Maybe I had the axle drooped too far during the install?
 
Thanks, I was questioning if this was the right way, but I tried the other way around and the center bar on the shackle was rubbing the metal mount in the frame. Maybe I had the axle drooped too far during the install?
Possibly - that's exactly what it's designed to do :)
 
Discussion starter · #25 · (Edited)
Possibly - that's exactly what it's designed to do :)
Thanks, I’ll try to flip them later this week.

I figured out a few of my remaining electrical gremlins today. Turns out my heater fan does in fact work, it just doesn’t turn on in the “vent” position (stupid operator’s fault).

I got the condenser fan to work correctly. Previously it was always on, regardless of whether the Jeep or a/c were on. Turns out that the supplied relay was fused in the on position, and oddly both pins 87 and 87a were always receiving power (which should never happen since they are supposed to be opposite from each other). Got a new relay and the system works great. I also replaced the relay for the horn. The relay now clicks when the horn button is pressed, but still no horn...... I’ll bust the ole test light out later this week, but at least I am working my way closer to the issue.

I also played around with the door open/closed switches, and now my dome light comes on, and stays on all the time unless I jiggle it..... need to do more investigating on this, but it looks like a PO may have removed the connector for the driver’s side door, so I need to track that down first.

These are all small fry issues, the Jeep drives and works fine as it is now, but I would like to get everything working as it was from the factory. Speaking of which, maybe I’ll tackle my parking brake issues this week as well... more updates soon.
 
Nice Jeep! Keep up the good work!...its a labor of love to bring these old jeeps back into their prime...on your locks not working...its probably the plastic clips on the lock rods...they get brittle and just fall apart and need replaced. Good Luck!
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
The wife and I took yesterday off to take the YJ for a spin and spend some time in Destin. The Jeep drove great and we had a fun time cruising around to get lunch and ice cream cake. No off-roading or beach driving though, I still need to figure out how to get a beach driving permit for the county.

Today I finally installed the ignition immobilizer that I bought from Digital Guard Dawg over a month ago. The unit I got is actually for motorcycles or ATVs, but was recommended by the company because I didn't need push button start or any of the advanced features like automatic door locks or window controls. This option is not on their website, but I appreciate the phone rep for telling me about it because it was about 1/4th the cost of a full push button start system. I mentioned in an earlier post that my ignition cylinder doesn't need a key to start the Jeep. I found out today that this is only partially true, I can actually force the ignition cylinder to the lock position which will require the key to unlock it. However, it is a real bear to get the ignition cylinder out of the lock position so I decided to press with the ignition immobilizer install and only use the lock position when I feel like I need additional security (which will require the use of the key). The immobilizer unit also gives me a deduction on my car insurance! :dance:

The unit itself is very basic, only four wires: constant hot, ground, and two wires to splice into the starter relay circuit. It requires the use of a wireless key fob to unlock the starter relay circuit, and the key fob can either be set to a proximity mode (like most modern cars use), or a manual mode which requires you to press the button on the fob and then start the vehicle within a few seconds. I ended up pulling the dash apart around the steering wheel and placing the unit just above my freshly installed a/c unit. Wiring was simple (ignore the first picture with the unit, I ended up cutting those long wires off), and finding the starter relay wire was easy because someone had already cut it and spliced it back together with butt connectors (they must have had an ignition kill switch and removed it prior to selling the vehicle).

I also took this opportunity to install the switch pod I build a few weeks ago. I carefully cut the hole in the factory plastic switch plate using a Dremel, and the switch pod snapped right in. I'm pretty happy with this location, and I wired it so all I have to do to add an accessory is to add a relay wire to the weatherpack connector that I located near the steering column.

Unfortunately, with all mods it seems like something inevitably gets broken in the process. After I buttoned everything up, I noticed that my turn signal indicator on the gauge cluster no longer works. :banghead: The signals still turn on correctly, so I must have hooked one of those two connectors going to the gauge cluster up incorrectly. Oh well, the electrical gremlin saga continues!
 

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The keyless option does come in handy. When we were kids my Army buddy showed up for the weekend in his 70 something POS Corvette on leave to stay with me for the weekend. While out terrorizing what was a small town at the time, Austin, TX we were pulled over and hauled to the graybar hotel. They threw him in for drunk driving and firing his gun through the open sunroof while doing 100+ down the freeway. They impounded his car and refused to give me a free ride back home from the jail. Fortunately for me I remembered my friend telling me that you dont need a key to start the car, and I was able to simply walk out of the lobby and see the flatbed rolling that thing off in the parking lot. Jumped in it, twisted the cylinder and off I went 100 mph in the other direction!
 
Discussion starter · #29 ·
The keyless option does come in handy. When we were kids my Army buddy showed up for the weekend in his 70 something POS Corvette on leave to stay with me for the weekend. While out terrorizing what was a small town at the time, Austin, TX we were pulled over and hauled to the graybar hotel. They threw him in for drunk driving and firing his gun through the open sunroof while doing 100+ down the freeway. They impounded his car and refused to give me a free ride back home from the jail. Fortunately for me I remembered my friend telling me that you dont need a key to start the car, and I was able to simply walk out of the lobby and see the flatbed rolling that thing off in the parking lot. Jumped in it, twisted the cylinder and off I went 100 mph in the other direction!
Haha, not exactly my intent by going "keyless" but still pretty funny!
 
Discussion starter · #30 ·
So the good idea fairy hit me today. I've been looking at some options to upgrade the axles on my JK. It's a 2016 Rubicon, so it has Dana 44s, electronic lockers and 4.10s. Then it hit me, I could upgrade the axles in the JK and then steal the Dana 44s for the YJ. All I'd really need to do is cut off the factory brackets and weld on the appropriate brackets for a YJ. To me this has a few advantages and disadvantages:

Advantages:
  • Reuse the takeoffs from my own vehicle (I would say I am saving $$$, others would say I am just spending more of it)
  • Axles already come configured (gears, lockers, etc) like I would want for 35s on the YJ with a V8
  • Wider axles would allow me to run a little more backspacing versus stock YJ width axles (saves some wear and tear on balljoints and other components)

Disadvantage:
  • The JK Dana 44s are not the strongest axles available. Would likely need some additional upgrades (chromoly shafts, more stout lockers, etc.) to handle the additional torque that a V8 has
  • Requires more "figuring", need to assemble proper components (spring perches, brackets, etc.) to be compatible with the YJ
  • Wheel lug spacing is not same as YJ (not really a con, just something to remember)

This is more of me thinking out loud than actually considering this option right now. If anyone has any experience or thoughts on this, please let me know.
 
This is more of me thinking out loud than actually considering this option right now. If anyone has any experience or thoughts on this, please let me know.
If 35" tires are your end goal, then I see no reason why you shouldn't use the JK axles, particularly since you already have them and understand the areas of weakness.

Some thoughts as they came to me:
A1) As you know, the JK D44 tubes aren't the strongest around, though easily remedied with a good sleeve/truss. The C's are an area of concern as well, but options readily available.

2) Brackets are simple - I would call any of the common online retailers like Barnes, RuffStuff, etc. and let them you know you need a set of perches and shock mounts to fit the JK axles and I'm sure the customer service reps all have the tube diameter memorized to heart by now.

D) I know you're thinking a V8 swap is in the future, but likely plan on regearing. 35"s and 4.10's generally suck pretty hard with any semi-modern overdrive transmission.

4) I know 2 JKU guys running V8's in their rigs on factory D44's (both Rubi's) and they have no issues with the axles holding up. There is a local guy with a Hellcrate-JKU also running factory Rubi axles and he usually all 707 horses quite often.

5) JK lug pattern is an advantage IMO - plenty of aftermarket options including beadlocks that are commonly found lightly used on the local sale pages.

The real question - what axles (and tires?) are you thinking for the JK?
 
Discussion starter · #33 ·
If 35" tires are your end goal, then I see no reason why you shouldn't use the JK axles, particularly since you already have them and understand the areas of weakness.
The real question - what axles (and tires?) are you thinking for the JK?
If you had asked me that when I bought the JKU, I would have immediately responded with "Full width Dana 60s fully built to support 37s in the hard rocks." Now, two kids and a couple moves later I'm looking at my primary use for the JKU: Overland on washboard roads, with the hard off-roading limited mostly to getting to and from a campsite, with the occasional road trips out west to play in the harder stuff (granted now a lot of the harder stuff will be done in the YJ). Because of that, priority is something safe for my kids to be in and reliable enough to not strand me during/after wheeling on a road trip.

I noticed that Dynatrac sells a beefed up Dana 44, with 1/2 tubes, larger forged ends and stronger ball joints. They even have the option to build the axle with more built in caster if I decide to add a little more lift to accommodate 37s (or I could just get a set of Metal Cloak fenders, decisions decisions). This would resolve 95% of the issues with the stock Dana 44, with the added advantage of bolting up directly and compatibility with existing parts for my JKU.

For the YJ, this would require me to find a JK dana 44 rear axle (to match width and lug spacing), but those are extremely easy to find in junkyards / classifieds since the JK was out for over 10 years and the prices on them aren't too bad. This would require a regear and lockers, but I'd be stuck doing the regear anyway with any axle combo. The goal is still to get on 35s with as little lift as possible (probably will go MC flares on the YJ), which I could probably do with upgraded shafts up front and a Ford 8.8 in the back, but I like to keep my options open.

Pretty much my exact response.... labels for the points and everything (A1,2,D,4,5) :)

I am real happy with my v8, 35's, and 4.56's.
How much better do you think a V8/35s would be with 4.56s vs 4.10s? My JKU has 35s with 4.10s and it drives pretty nice with the factory 3.7L minivan engine. Granted it has a 6 speed manual with two overdrive gears, and 4:1 transfer case which make drivability better both on and off-road.

Also, one of the things I like most about Jeeping is the build itself, so cost and performance are not the only considerations I have when selecting parts. My wife frequently asks "Why do you need a 500 horsepower motor and Corvette suspension geometry on your 67 Firebird?" and my response is always "Why not?!" The same goes for my Jeeps. Now I'm not talking about building a mall crawler here (no skinny tires or underglows for me), but sometimes the best feeling comes from completing a more extensive build and just knowing that you have the extra capability if you ever need/want it. :action-smiley:
 
Discussion starter · #34 ·
Just a small update today. Got the turn signals working, I completely missed the pins on one of the connectors going to the instrument ribbon cable thing (it was wedged between the pins and the plastic housing so it felt like it was connected when I reinstalled it). Also installed a Bestop bikini top. I had a SpiderWebShade on there, which looked great but I found that the sun was burning me alive here in Florida. No hit at all on SpiderWebShades at all, they are quality products and I still run one with my JK, I just needed something that would provide more shade with the YJ. Still need to flip those shackles around, hopefully I’ll find some time this week to do that.
 
Maybe it's just me but it sounds like the JKU you have serves a very important niche and role - a family/overland rig. Would going to bigger axles and 37" tires add any appreciable benefit to the rig? Perhaps some, but honestly it doesn't sound like much to me. With 2 wee-ones of my own, a lower, easier to load and get into, and more stable rig that can haul everything you need seems like something you already have and already do well with. Sometimes, and I struggle with this too, it's good to "leave well enough alone!" :)

That being said, if you're intending to wheel the YJ hard, it would make sense to focus on the YJ. Dollar for dollar, you'd be hard pressed to find a set of axles beefier than a set of Super Duty axles, which can be had for very cheap. These may be overkill for 35" tires, so another option would be something similar to mine ("Jeep width" D44's). You'd easily do well with 35" tires and can do so relatively easily and affordably (compared to buying JKU Dynatracs, then modifying those JKU factory axles to work with the YJ).

Regarding the 4.10/4.56+ - it really depends on what trans you're going to use. The OD ratio of the later GM auto trans is 0.70:1, so it doesn't mind some gearing for sure! I run a V8 in my Ram with the same OD ratio and 34" tires and run 4.88's...
 
How much better do you think a V8/35s would be with 4.56s vs 4.10s? My JKU has 35s with 4.10s and it drives pretty nice with the factory 3.7L minivan engine. Granted it has a 6 speed manual with two overdrive gears, and 4:1 transfer case which make drivability better both on and off-road.
My thoughts here are if you have an axle with 4.10's already in there. Put it in there and run it. If you find that you need a little more address it then. The type of driving / wheeling that you do could differ from what others do. If you end up getting new axles I would definitely look at 4.56's or maybe 4.88's. My Jeep hasn't made it above around 40 mph yet since my home made rear drive shaft says so. I really can't say much about highway driveability, but it sure does work good in the dirt.
 
Discussion starter · #37 ·
Maybe it's just me but it sounds like the JKU you have serves a very important niche and role - a family/overland rig. Would going to bigger axles and 37" tires add any appreciable benefit to the rig? Perhaps some, but honestly it doesn't sound like much to me. With 2 wee-ones of my own, a lower, easier to load and get into, and more stable rig that can haul everything you need seems like something you already have and already do well with. Sometimes, and I struggle with this too, it's good to "leave well enough alone!"
Image


That being said, if you're intending to wheel the YJ hard, it would make sense to focus on the YJ. Dollar for dollar, you'd be hard pressed to find a set of axles beefier than a set of Super Duty axles, which can be had for very cheap. These may be overkill for 35" tires, so another option would be something similar to mine ("Jeep width" D44's). You'd easily do well with 35" tires and can do so relatively easily and affordably (compared to buying JKU Dynatracs, then modifying those JKU factory axles to work with the YJ).

Regarding the 4.10/4.56+ - it really depends on what trans you're going to use. The OD ratio of the later GM auto trans is 0.70:1, so it doesn't mind some gearing for sure! I run a V8 in my Ram with the same OD ratio and 34" tires and run 4.88's...
Agreed, 35s with the current lift are probably best for how I currently use the JK. It’s so hard to just leave things alone with these Jeeps! Regarding gearing, I plan on running the AX-15 I have with the V8 (will have it rebuilt, probably by Novak). I’ll toss some numbers into a gear ratio calculator to see where I want to be. That said, anything has to be better than what I have now (factory gears, 33s, a whopping 2200 RPM at 55 mph in THIRD gear.

How much better do you think a V8/35s would be with 4.56s vs 4.10s? My JKU has 35s with 4.10s and it drives pretty nice with the factory 3.7L minivan engine. Granted it has a 6 speed manual with two overdrive gears, and 4:1 transfer case which make drivability better both on and off-road.
My thoughts here are if you have an axle with 4.10's already in there. Put it in there and run it. If you find that you need a little more address it then. The type of driving / wheeling that you do could differ from what others do. If you end up getting new axles I would definitely look at 4.56's or maybe 4.88's. My Jeep hasn't made it above around 40 mph yet since my home made rear drive shaft says so. I really can't say much about highway driveability, but it sure does work good in the dirt.
Yeah I definitely see the benefit to more gear off-road, and agree on the approach to try it and change the gears if I think I need more.

I was also doing a little more research, and Mopar sells brand new versions of the JK/JL rear axles and they can be had for $1700. When you consider the cost of gears and an elocker alone (probably $1300-1400 before installation), and whatever a Ford 8.8 at a pick and pull place goes for ($200-500?) that makes going this route more economical (finding a used axle even more so). Of course this would require a new front axle to match the width ($2200 new), but considering the price of gears and lockers and other upgrades my Dana 30 would need I think it this would come in pretty close. Of course I would need spring perches and shock mounts (not expensive), and I can weld those on myself no problem.

Just more thinking out loud, but I appreciate everyone’s inputs and suggestions.
 
Discussion starter · #38 ·
I was hoping to get a bunch of work done on the YJ in time for Independence Day and the weekend, but unfortunately I ended up with acute appendicitis on Friday and had to go to the ER to have my appendix taken out. The doc tells me I'm not supposed to lift anything over 15 lbs for the next 6 weeks, so it looks like I won't be doing any hard wrenching on the YJ for a bit (I did re-glue the rear view mirror button on, and it lasted 2 hours before falling off this time :banghead:). I also flipped my shackles around so they are hanging correctly now, but that's all I'll probably do for a bit.

With all of this free time, I've had plenty of time to shop around and figure out the direction for the next phase of my build. I want to be able to enjoy the YJ for the rest of the summer, so I'm not prepared to put any major mods into it until fall sometime. That gives me time to start accumulating some parts on the side so I can have everything ready for the big upgrade. It took me a little longer to get the YJ up to standards, so the lines between phase 1 and phase 2 of my original post got a little blurred. That said, let's just call this new direction for the build "Phase B". Here's what I'm thinking:

Mechanical/Suspension: The goal here is to safely run V8 power with 35s. I have put a lot of thought into going the 4 link route, but I don't foresee myself needing that level of capability any time soon, and I really would like to stay true to the character of the YJ so I'll be going with leafs.
  • LM7 V8 Swap - all adapters and mounts from Novak, upgraded radiator with electric fans
  • AX15 Transmission - Rebuild (currently works pretty good but needs new synchros for 2nd and 4th)
  • NP231 Transfer Case - Rebuild (probably hasn't been done and should be prior to V8 swap). It currently has a SYE of unknown brand so I need to research it. Depending on what's on there I might swap it for a SYE from a reputable source.
  • Driveshafts - Adams
  • 3" Lift - 2.5" RE 1430 springs, RE 1/2" lift boomerang shackles, new u-bolts
  • Shocks - Fox IFP or similar, will upgrade mounts with MORE shock hoops (front) and shock extension adapter (rear)
  • Axles - Still thinking about JK Dana 44s, or I may just pull a Ford 8.8 for the rear, keep my Dana 30 up front and upgrade both with new shafts, gears (4.56) and Eaton E-Lockers
  • Steering column/box - definitely something wrong with mine. I can feel a ticking when I turn the wheel. I checked the linkage and there is no interference. one or both of these parts will rebuilt so I have rock solid steering.
  • Wheels/Tires - 17" wheels (for bigger brakes) with MTRs
Body/Armor/Cosmetic: Really everything here was selected for functionality. Metal Cloak fenders let me run 35's with minimal lift, which will minimize issues with handling and steering for street ability (road trips) while still getting the offload performance I'm looking for.
  • Fenders - Metal Cloak Overlines with 4" or 6" flares depending on overall width
  • Rear Bumper - Leaning toward LOD Signature Series with the integrated tire carrier, the bumper is actually for a TJ but I am told it fits the YJ, has some nice features like integrated backup lights and mounts for hi-lift/shovel/rotopax/etc.
  • Front Bumper - Poison Spyder BFH with brawler bar
  • Rocker Armor - Metal Cloak rockers with integrated step (matches up with flares)
  • Winch - Warn Zeon 8s (very happy with the 10s version on my JK, but probably don't need the full 10k for the YJ)
  • Replace windshield frame and glass (going to get glass with rearview mirror button already attached :pullinghair:)
  • Soft Top - I'm up in the air here, I like the benefits of a full soft top, but the factory YJ top is a PITA to take up and put down. A Bestop Supertop costs $$$, so I'll probably just add a wind jammer and duster cover to my current strapless bikini and just run with it.
  • Paint - will get some dents removed and have the exterior only repainted in the factory Radiant Fire color. There is a local body/paint shop that I am interested in using for my 67 Firebird, so I'm going to use this as an opportunity to check their work before I drop big bucks on a classic car restoration.
Electrical: Not much work here, add a CB and a few (tasteful) lights, radio is shot and needs replacing.
  • Aux Fuse Panel - Bussmann custom fuse/relay panel
  • CB Radio - Cobra 75 WX ST with 3' or 4' Firestik and external speaker
  • Stereo - Replace, haven't decided components but it will be a simple head unit with 4 channel speakers, probably run an amp for the speakers but won't have a sub (initially)
  • Lighting - Will run Rigid flush mounts in the rear bumper (backup lights) because thats what fits, likely KC LED round lights on the A-pillar and maybe on the bumper to maintain an age appropriate look
Interior: Mostly restoration type stuff.
  • New seat upholstery - might need new seats, almost all of the factory foam is missing, drivers seat does not adjust, back seat had something living in it at one point....
  • Bedrug or vinyl flooring
  • Tuffy 6.5" locking center console - I currently have an 8" console of another brand, it is too wide and interferes with the seatbelts. The Tuffy 6.5" is the perfect size and can be keyed to match the accessories in my JK so one less key to carry around.
  • Replace sun visors (currently missing)
  • New seatbelts - current ones are shot
  • Bestop Roll Bar Covers - threw mine away because they were torn / faded beyond recognition

The goal is to complete Phase B in time for Jeep Beach 2020 (April 26).
 
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Seems like a solid plan to me. The only thing I may consider at this stage would be a little wheelbase stretch. Maybe a wagoneer spring for 1.5" stretch per end. A little more wheelbase does add stability.
 
Discussion starter · #40 ·
Seems like a solid plan to me. The only thing I may consider at this stage would be a little wheelbase stretch. Maybe a wagoneer spring for 1.5" stretch per end. A little more wheelbase does add stability.
That’s not a bad idea. How would that affect shock mounts/steering linkage? I would need to figure out the back trimming end too. Metal Cloaks rear flare mount requires a small trim (they call it “mod cut”), which I’m pretty sure is assumed to be centered. Do most people leave the rear openings alone for 1.5” of stretch, or do they just trim a little farther back? A mild stretch helps with the driveshaft angles as well so I’m definitely considering this.
 
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